Held here entire — 588 passages across 34 chapters, set down from the first word to the last. The colour shifts with the film’s own mood as each chapter plays.
- 0:00warm, expansiveStar Wars Theology Space RecapThe host frames this session as a follow-up to a prior discussion on Star Wars theology and ethics.
- 2:39weathered, resignedTolkien's World and Character ArcsThe host outlines plans to explore Tolkien's background, character symbolism, and the macroeconomic context of the trilogy.
- 3:38guarded, evenPalantir and Modern ParallelsThe host previews how artifacts like the Palantir connect the trilogy to modernity.
- 4:15warm, expansiveWelcoming Co-Host @malleusIGThe host introduces Rabbi @malleusIG as the featured guest and praises his analytical contributions.
- 5:57quiet, reflective@malleusIG Reads Tolkien Twitter ParodyThe co-host opens with a humorous recast of the Ring-verse from the Lord of the Rings.
- 9:06measured, soberLord of the Rings in Pop CultureThe conversation shifts to how the story has been referenced across television and animation.
- 12:35grave, forebodingGandalf and Saruman as MaiarThe discussion turns to the hidden nature of the wizards as demigods and how earth corrupts them.
- 16:35disillusionedLOTR as European TalmudThe discussion shifts to how Tolkien's work functions as a unifying mythological text for Europeans.
- 17:20broodingTolkien's Language and World BuildingThe host highlights Tolkien's linguistic genius and his remarkable literary friendship with C.S. Lewis.
- 19:58bleak, drainedRace Archetypes in Middle EarthThe speakers debate whether Tolkien's races map onto real-world human archetypes.
- 20:46grim, scorchedHobbits as Feminized NPCsThe guest argues that Hobbits represent an overly civilized, passive archetype.
- 29:14raw, woundedSauron's Covert Influence StrategyThe guest explains why Sauron's invisible, infiltrating evil is so effective.
- 33:30urgent, incendiaryElves Linked to Japanese ArchetypeThe guest suggests Elves map onto the highly civilized, formidable Japanese.
- 41:49tentative, hopefulThe Hero's Journey and InstinctsThe guest connects Tolkien's narrative structure to hardwired human instincts.
- 49:22dimmed, waryThe Ring as Central BankingThe guest interprets the One Ring as a metaphor for international banking.
- 58:23heated, combativeGandalf the White and RebirthThe panel discusses Gandalf's resurrection and its parallels to the second coming of Christ.
- 1:10:43sombre, searchingSauron as the DemiurgeA caller suggests Sauron represents a Gnostic demiurge rather than a simple villain.
- 1:19:40smouldering, restlessGandalf as Christ FigureThe speakers debate whether Gandalf's death and resurrection mirror the story of Jesus Christ.
- 1:30:44unsettlingThe Ring as Power and WealthThe conversation shifts to interpreting the One Ring as a symbol of centralized power and wealth.
- 1:34:55murky, uneasyThe Fall of European ManThe conversation connects the fading era of men in Middle Earth to modern demographics.
- 1:37:59cool, analyticalPalantir and Modern Surveillance TechThe host connects Tolkien's seeing stones to modern tech companies like Palantir and Anduril.
- 1:52:18conflicted, dividedGollum as Frodo's ShadowThe discussion shifts to Gollum representing the dark path Frodo could take.
- 2:04:43hard-wonThe Jewish Golem and GollumThe guest draws an etymological and thematic link between Gollum and the Jewish Golem.
- 2:10:57charged, alertFly You Fools Eagle TheoryThe host and a caller debate why the fellowship didn't just use the eagles to fly to Mordor.
- 2:14:28detached, weighingSurveillance State and DemoralizationThe host pivots to discussing the modern surveillance state and its demoralizing effects.
- 2:17:57dry, matter-of-factCatholic Morality and White HatsA speaker explains how his Catholic upbringing gives him hope against digital enslavement.
- 2:19:16eerie, electricFeanor and the Great ElvesThe conversation turns to the great elves of the First Age and their battles against Balrogs.
- 2:27:01grave, forebodingTom Bombadil and Abramelin the MageA caller links Tom Bombadil to the historical story of Abramelin the Mage and Kabbalah.
- 2:31:57hard, unyieldingAsymptotic Control and White PillsA speaker argues that increasing control reveals the establishment's hand and gives hope.
- 2:37:18worn, nostalgicAmerican Gun Ownership and RebellionSpeakers debate whether American civilian gun ownership can prevent tyranny.
- 2:45:00raw, woundedSmall Arms Against TyrannyA caller challenges the utility of firearms against a modern state, sparking debate.
- 2:57:42grave, forebodingSCOTUS and Constitutional RightsA speaker finds hope in the Supreme Court's originalist interpretation of the Constitution.
- 3:02:22weathered, resignedThe One Ring Replica AnecdoteA speaker shares a funny story about wearing a replica of the One Ring on a date.
- 3:04:18measured, soberLes Miserables and the LawThe discussion connects Les Miserables to the differences between Jewish and Christian morality.
The Transcript
A voice is named only when we can verify it — by voiceprint, an @handle present in the room, or the Space’s own title. Anyone we can’t confirm stays “Speaker,” on purpose.
Speaker 1Okay, perfect.
@malleusigJust as I was looking for you.
@malleusigAll right. Now I'm going to accept the co-host invite, but if anything goes wrong, I'm going to have to ask you to bring me up again. Give me a sec.
@malleusigOkay. All right. One for one on the co-host acceptance. How are you doing? How's everyone doing?
Ian MalcolmSo far, so good. And I feel it's only It's required, it's incumbent upon us to kick this off as follows.
Ian MalcolmWith that, we are going to kick things off. I figured we'd give a moment for people to hop into the space as we did that. And we got to give a little bit of tribute. And there's going to be a couple different segments that I'm going to want to play throughout to kind of add to some of the ideologies that we're going to be sharing here and really quickly just to orient ourselves.
Ian MalcolmSo this is a follow-up space. to the one that we previously did on the idea of Star Wars and the theology, the religion, and the ethics that were behind, not the new Disneyfied version, but rather the stories of old under George Lucas. And so what we're gonna be going through here is going to be J.R.R. Tolkien's masterpiece, The Lord of the Rings and its trilogy.
Ian MalcolmWe'll probably stay away from The Hobbit. and to keep it focused on the primary trilogy, although I'm sure there will be some overlap or call-outs to that other work. And what we're gonna do as we weave through this is gonna be, of course, some storytelling, some parallels between the world that was created by that brilliant man.
Ian MalcolmWe'll have some background information on who Tolkien was, who were some of the individuals in his social circles, how did that perhaps influence his view of the world. and in what's going to be a curious exercise, we'll also try to unpack who exactly are these characters? What did they represent, if anything? Like the light and the dark side of Lucas's trilogy, is there something that's being told here that's not about necessarily just ethics or morality, but is there also a story that's being told about the world around us?
Ian MalcolmAfter all, it's worth revisiting what years were these works written in? What was happening in the macroeconomic, and the geopolitical fronts at that time. So we're gonna unpack a lot of these things. We'll talk about the characters, talk about the stories, the lands, and then we'll probably find ourselves discussing how some of these items from these stories find themselves in modernity, including for example, the Palantir.
Ian MalcolmWhat was that in that work and how does it play into the world around us? And so we will be weaving a lot of these. I want to first and foremost thank The wonderful co-hostess with the most is Ms. JoAnn, who is up here with us. She, like I say every time, the workhorse of X. She is the four workhorse woman of the non-apocalypse.
Ian MalcolmShe's gonna help us avert that. And we might have some other friends come up and come through. I hope everybody feels comfortable. Request a mic, come up, make this a collaborative conversation. It's gonna be largely led by Mr. Rabbi [guest]. I wanna welcome him as not only the co-host, but the featured guest of the day here and his ability to break down these stories, the arcs of the characters and the significance thereof.
Ian MalcolmIt always creates not only thought provoking conversations, but also a lot of laughter and a lot of love along the way. And so I view him not just as a heroic mind, but also a heroic person and a good friend. And so I'm very humbled that he's here. I also want to shout out to Mr. SatChaser and Ann who both came up here.
Ian MalcolmSat, another wonderful contributor to this community, to this movement. And I welcome anybody and everybody, whether you're listening presently or you might listen to the playback, feel free to inject any and every one of your comments, whether it's now or somewhere in the distant future, as we proceed down the path to Moldor.
Ian MalcolmAnd feel free to use that purple pill. If you don't feel comfortable coming up and requesting a mic, please throw out any thoughts, suggestions, heckles, harassments. I welcome all of them. And so with that, Mr. Rabbi, as a way to maybe orient the audience, you know, we did the prior space on the Star Wars trilogy. I'm sure a lot of people in here may be familiar with not only your work, but also with that conversation.
Ian MalcolmBut in the event there are any that are not, if you wouldn't mind just introducing yourself to kind of the audience here, maybe give a very quick, if you can, 60 seconds on some of the more significant aspects of the prior space on the Star Wars trilogy. and then if you wouldn't mind maybe just outlining or bulleting a couple of the most critical pieces of today's conversation that you're excited for.
Ian MalcolmAnd with that, I'll turn it over to you.
@malleusigAll right, fantastic. And before I do that, I would like to solemnize the occasion with a short reading from the great holy book of Twitter.
@malleusigIt began with the forging of the great slurs. Three letters were given to the homos, gayest of all beings. Four to the Jew lords, the great financiers and bankers of the mountain halls. And six, six letters were gifted to the race of blacks, who above all else desire bicycles.
@malleusigOkay, I just wanted this. It was just so perfect with his face. Full credit goes to Zachary Rule, ZJ Rule, who wrote that originally. And it's just perfect.
Ian MalcolmAnd I promise you, Rabbi, it'll make for a perfect AI video when Vilek gets his hands on it. I can't wait for that one.
@malleusigOh wait, maybe it was... Holy shit. Wait, I'm seeing like so many people wrote this, so... Maybe we don't know who came up with it first.
Ian MalcolmOh no, I can just envision Vilek who does a lot of the AI videos. One of the funnier ones being the one with Max Nordau on the bicycle, and I can just envision he might incorporate that character along with some of the others into this. What you just did there almost reminded me of something out of South Park, who ironically, I suppose we might have to touch upon that at some point in this, but even the Jews over at South Park created a parody of Lord of the Rings.
Ian MalcolmSo a timeless piece of literature that finds its way even into Cartman's backyard. But back to you.
@malleusigYeah, that was actually one of the best episodes. It's like when they, when they, what was it? They, they find the porn tape and they have to return it. It is.
Ian MalcolmAnd it's, uh, it's like little kids. I don't, I can't remember. It's, it's Butters, I think it is, or Timmy, who is, uh, who, who refers to the adult film tape as my precious. It's right, right. And they're like, we can't allow this to exist.
@malleusigWe have to destroy it. It's too powerful. Oh.
@malleusigYeah. No, dude. The shit South Park got away with in the 90s, it's amazing. I wish we could do it today. I wish we could do it today. And it wasn't that bad back then. But anyway. Yeah, so for anyone that doesn't know me, I guess I do stuff on Twitter. I just like talking about this kind of thing. And... So we did the Star Wars one last time, which is really good.
@malleusigI'm like the worst PR person for myself. I have no idea what to talk about. Yeah, it was a good space. It was a great space. And I'm looking forward to this one.
Ian MalcolmNo, I appreciate that. And speaking of references in South Park, I just looked up, for what it's worth, some of the most notable examples of animated or live televisions making reference of Lord of the Rings. Number one is South Park. The Return of the Fellowship of the Rings of the Two Towers is the name of the episode.
Ian MalcolmThe Simpsons, Family Guy, Futurama, Dead Ringers, The Big Bang Theory, Gilmore Girls, New Girl, Stranger Things, Flight of the Concords, and even Friends. So just going to show the degree of, let's say, reverence and or referenceability that this movie, this literature, and kind of these ideas carry over. It is something that appears to be timeless.
Ian MalcolmAnd I bring that up because, Rabbi, just like with the idea of Star Wars, I think that something in there inherently tapped into The only thing that I still can't quite understand is the idea that Saruman and Sauron
Ian Malcolmthat somehow Gandalf didn't see that coming, that the guy whose name is literally just the main villain's name plus the word man, at no point was Gandalf like, oh, I think I might see what's coming here. But nonetheless, very crystal clear. It's a Sauron man. Yeah, exactly. He might as well have been evil man. And it's, oh, wow, he turned on me.
Ian MalcolmWhat a shock. But nonetheless, this idea of the story, the fundamentals that are in it, it's probably best, I think, to start with the idea of the Fellowship of the Rings, especially given the title of the space. Because I do think, and I did go back and I looked through some of the films and also some of the works that are attached to them in, I guess, quote unquote, preparation, which didn't require a lot of work because, man, they are fun and interesting to watch.
Ian MalcolmBut this idea of even the Fellowship, right? I think there's significance to the, and we talk about diversity in lots of different ways in these spaces, but the diversity of characters that come together for a common purpose against the primary villain, right? Very relevant perhaps for the world that we live in as are some of the fundamental concepts that there is perhaps the one ring to rule them all, the one thing to rule them all.
Ian MalcolmAnd what exactly is that? Is it an idea? Is it merely evil? Is it something that can be codified into a single Thank you so much for joining us.
Ian MalcolmSome of the major either themes, ideas, or characters that were introduced to in that first film, and some of the more relevant pieces that you might want to start unpacking throughout the space.
@malleusigYeah, sure. So I guess the first thing that I would start with is, and this is one of the things that really doesn't get covered in the books until you get to the Silmarillion, but... So both Gandalf and Saruman are basically not, they're not humans. They're basically kind of demigods. They're called Maiar, right? And so there's this very interesting dynamic that's immediately set up where you look at, you look at like the way that, how can I put this?
@malleusigBecause you get into the situation where you're talking about how earth corrupts even the highest spirits, right? The gods in his, In his cosmology never actually come down to earth right so it's they're out of the out of the picture entirely but the closest thing to them the Maiar they decide to come down and start influencing and teaching humanity and only one only Gandalf is is not corrupted right so he's very much kind of a Jesus figure um and then the other lines are like because Sodom is corrupted he's corrupted by pride right by his pride over his his his ability to
@malleusigHis ability to you know in magic and how much better is it than everyone else that's kind of thing and you see an analogy there with in the Quran you see how basically they talk about Muhammad talks about how the even the angel I think Gabriel said it through but even the angels who came to earth were corrupted by their lives on earth and became lost essentially at one point
@malleusigIn the Quran it talks about that. So as a human, if you are able to navigate the world uncorrupted, you're doing better than even the angels, which is a very interesting thing to read about.
@malleusigAnd then you have to get into the part where Tolkien supposedly was granted access to the Vatican Library before he wrote Lord of the Rings. And so there's this whole online theory about how basically it's not fiction. It's actually, it's a coded history of the human race. It's like a coded, it's basically, he took the history that he saw in the Vatican and rewrote it as fiction to get it passed.
@malleusigYou know, the people that are checking for that kind of thing. And so in a way, the Lord of the Rings now becomes, for Europeans, it becomes kind of our, you know, kind of like our Torah in the sense that In the sense that the Torah for Jewish people is this incredibly, incredibly fulfilling book to have because it tells the story of your people and the history and it grounds you not only to your history but to every other Jewish person through that book.
@malleusigI cannot overstate the psychological benefit of having a Torah, of having a book that everyone in your
@malleusigMost of people's belief in the book and most of our subscription to it. Most people, most Christians look at the book and they don't really subscribe to it all these days. A lot of them are atheists or hedonists or, you know, they engage in essentially, how can I put this? You know, they basically denigrate it while at the same time just accepting everyone else's, you know,
@malleusigFervor for Their Own Books Without Criticism. I guess I'm kind of off on a wild tangent here. So in a way, Lord of the Rings is kind of like the European non-Christian Talmud. It's kind of like a shared myth system that young, nerdy, pimply-faced boys can all kind of get together, and myself is definitely included in that, all kind of get together and connect to each other through.
@malleusigAnd in that sense, it has real psychological value. I think the only other the only book that has as much psychological value as as Lord of the Rings would be Dune. And Dune doesn't have anywhere near the same kind of readership or fan base. So but yeah, that's kind of my initial take on that. What are you guys thoughts?
Ian MalcolmYou know, and I'd also say for what it's worth, I feel like the world building in Lord of the Rings obviously goes above and beyond even that of Dune. And a lot of that I think has to do with Tolkien and his fascination as an individual with language. And it's worth noting that this individual was essentially a prodigy throughout most of his life, kind of revered in his inner circles for his brilliance.
Ian MalcolmAnd just as a couple interesting call-outs, Not only, you know, in some of these high level academic courses that he was taking and teaching it, in fact, at one point, but befriended of all people, C.S. Lewis, which is considered one of the, I guess, most prominent and remarkable literary friendships of all time, especially given some of the works that C.S.
Ian MalcolmLewis did. And then also, of course, Tolkien fascinated with language and as kind of a prodigy and a brilliant individual. was fascinated with language so much so that he even created his own languages for these characters, right, that existed in this world.
@malleusigHe literally made languages for each of the races in the book. Like, that's a level of overkill that is absolutely insane. Huge respect to Tolkien. Absolutely.
Ian MalcolmAnd for what it's worth, before we maybe unpack more of the story itself at, let's say, the details of the pages themselves, right, the concept for this... I feel like it's something that we should unpack a little bit because it's worth noting, again, in the backstory of Tolkien, this is a person who fought through World War I, was involved in trench warfare, which I think people today, especially those that are less interested in history of yesterday, can't comprehend the degree of utter destruction and devastation that living through something like that would have resulted in.
Ian MalcolmAnd to think that that individual came out of that having experienced firsthand kind of the horrors of war, seeing all of the things playing out on the geopolitical landscape with various nations at war with one another, various people, perhaps, and ideologies at war with one another. And I'm curious, Rabbi, for your thoughts just overall when it comes to this world that he built in this fantastical story, if you see any similarities or parallels
Ian MalcolmWhether you're thinking of the Shire and what that might represent compared to Moldor, compared to all these other places that we're going to kind of visit throughout the stories. And if he was painting a picture at 50,000 feet, that perhaps was more than just a piece of fantasy.
@malleusigOh, definitely. No, definitely. No, I mean, if you look at the races, the definitely seems to be not, it doesn't seem to map onto races per se, but it seems to map onto psychological archetypes or like you know person person types you have you know the humans which are humans which are like kind of like our way it's like the way to anchor us into the world essentially it's it's it's the characters that give us like stakes because if there were no humans in the book it would just be hobbits and elves and you know orcs fighting each other and like we wouldn't care we wouldn't have any reason to care at all right so we gotta have someone to root for
@malleusigbut then you look at the other races and they do seem to be kind of exaggerated tendencies or stereotypes, right? So it's like you have the hobbits, the hobbits really seem like, they seem like people that are too civilized, like they're almost feminized, right? You look at the hobbits, like they're like, they have eight meals a day or whatever it is, like they have three tea times, they never leave the shire, they are,
@malleusigThey're constantly engaging in gossiping and backbiting and like personal politics inside the Shire. They're worried about, you know, who has a better family. They're basically kind of like, almost like, I put this, it's almost like high school cliques. You know what I mean? Like high school girls, basically. If high school girls was a race, it's basically would be the hobbits.
@malleusigAnd for me, this is kind of like the people that, you know, We really don't talk to Untolder because they're the ones that would just kind of go along with whatever is the main thing, right? The Hobbits, you get the feeling that if Sauron had won, they would be the ones that just kind of like, okay, fine, well, I guess we're with Sauron now, and they would just kind of go with them.
@malleusigThey're the 40% that just go with whatever the current thing is, right? The Hobbits, you know, aside from Frodo, would definitely all have put in black squares on their Facebook profiles immediately as soon as it became a thing. They're basically like if NPCs were a race, I think. right so that's that's one and then you have the orcs it's obviously black people um and then you have uh i'm just kidding i'm just kidding i think i think the orcs i think Tolkien actually did kind of intend to uh he did kind of intend to parody not parody he'd kind of tend to create an archetype of the less developed cultures in the world like the cultures that are still really just kind of like
@malleusigClong their way out of the Stone Age. And that really transcends race, but definitely does include a lot of Africa. You're not going to gaslight me into thinking that it doesn't. And especially when you look at the main theme of what's happening with the orcs. Well, they're being weaponized by the wizard against the humans.
@malleusigLike, come on! Like, you, like, Tolkien couldn't spell it out any clearer for you guys. Like, the wizards are literally raising and breeding and arming the orcs and then sending them to fight against the humans to exterminate them. I really can't think of any way that he could have laid this out any clearer without literally just saying it for real, right?
@malleusigWithout making it a book about, you know... or Stealing Bicycles or something. Like he could not have made this shit any clearer, guys.
Ian MalcolmYeah, and then you have like... Rather controversial take there, I'm sure, for the listeners. And for what it's worth, had a fun little game while looking over this and was looking online for some of these comparisons. And one of the common ones, just to call out the two groups that you just mentioned there, The Hobbits often referenced to being kind of the byproduct of...
Ian MalcolmIndustrialism. Individuals, essentially, a lot of claims that they were basically the pre-industrial English, in particular, those that were outside of major cities, right? Just kind of living their lives, doing their things independent of the world around them. And perhaps when there are conflicts and all these crazy animosities taking place in the world, they're just kind of indifferent, doing their own thing in their peaceful little solitude.
Ian Malcolmand something that you can, I suppose, critique because it lacks awareness, right? It's almost like Adam and Eve in the garden, right? These people, it's not that they're ignorant to it necessarily because they want to be ignorant, but rather just because they have their own little carve out and they're able to live there peacefully.
Ian MalcolmThe Oryx, obviously, to your point, Rabbi, comparisons can be made, very controversial in terms of tying it directly to a race. I just wanted to call this out because according to Tolkien himself, the book is Christian in its, let's say, mythology in the sense that it's where he derived the spirit and the sense of right and wrong.
Ian MalcolmHe would have to say that, though.
Ian MalcolmWe could look at, for example, crime and all kinds of other things. And maybe we could justify drawing the certain conclusions that you just were bringing up. But I would be curious because then we've got the wizards, right, that you talked about, this idea of them being gods. I'll be curious for your thoughts on who the wizards might represent.
Ian MalcolmAnd I say that especially given the fact that if you look at the physiognomy of Gandalf versus that of Saruman, there's a pretty... Transparent Differences Between the Two of Them, and Christopher Lee, the actor who portrayed Saruman, has a clear prosthetic added to his face that is a rather distinct call, but at the same time, other people would make references that perhaps the dwarves represent another group of people that we sometimes talk about frequently, and we can discuss how they were in the mines of Moria.
Ian MalcolmThey dug far too deep because of their greed and their unwillingness to care for humanity more than for their own greed is the comment loosely made by Gandalf. So who might the dwarves be? And then of course we have the elves, which I'll be very curious for some of your thoughts as to the headline of the space, who they may have been representing with that group of people.
@malleusigWell, see, this is why I actually favor the theory that they don't represent races or groups like directly. They represent kind of like human archetypes.
@malleusigThose archetypes will inevitably map onto different races in terms of stereotypes, but again, it doesn't directly do it. So the first thing you notice is the definite hierarchy. In terms of non-God-like beings, if you look at just the behavior and the ability for cognition, you have orcs at the bottom, and then you have, like, what?
@malleusigdwarves next then you have people then you have elves right because the elves are more definitely more more developed and advanced than humans are and then you have like basically wizards and then you have like you know i guess sauron is kind of like the evil like the evil uh you know uh almost like he's almost like a demiurge basically he's like he's like the the false god that wants to usurp the place of the other gods and take over earth right so
@malleusigThat would be kind of the way that I would look at it. And then you have the, you know, the, what was it?
@malleusigThe wraiths, I guess? The ring wraiths.
Ian MalcolmAh, the ring wraiths, yes. You know what I mean? The minions of Sauron, right?
@malleusigYeah, and so you have this whole idea of Sauron... Sauron doesn't go out and, like, try and attack, like, everyone directly. He did, you know, he did, and then he failed. Sauron basically the first time in the lore behind the book he basically had a physical form and he was this big giant dude with an axe or whatever or a hammer and he was going out and he was just like basically taking on the world kinetically and he was fighting armies and he had his own army and then he got defeated and I think he realized that you can't just go out and militarily take over the world because it's always going to fail
@malleusigAnd so then he used his influence over other people and relied almost exclusively on that. And that's what brought him closest to taking over the world, right? That was like the main thing. And so that for me is a major theme, this idea of infiltration and co-opting people while never actually showing your face is a far superior strategy for taking over control of large amounts of people, right?
@malleusigThis whole idea of The evil that wants to take over but never actually, no one ever speaks its name, it never comes out, never has a face, never shows itself. And for that reason, it's much harder to fight against, it's much harder to defend against because no one thinks it exists. So that's a huge thing. And again, I don't map that to the Jews.
@malleusigI think that especially when you talk about like Sauron being the all-seeing eye, now we're getting into basically what would be the organizational structure that, I'm sure it has a shit ton of Jews in it, but is something distinct from just Judaism for Jewry. It's something that transcends that and basically goes around and does things like using Satanism and human sacrifice and blackmail through its most willing and ready servants, yes, but it's not the Jews per se.
@malleusigSo that's one of the things that I... One of the things that I do think that represents. But I'm getting off topic. But what was the first question? And should we go to Ann because you get her hand up?
Ian MalcolmYeah, no, no, we can. And just real quick, it's interesting because you were mentioning there some of the different groups and how they might represent almost ideas or ideals. And just to read off a couple others that are pretty prominently called out. Elves often linked to either the Celts and or those that we would think of essentially as either Finnish or let's say Scandinavian with a language that actually in the book itself was closely resembled to and largely inspired by Finnish, which is very curious in this idea of the love of nature that they obviously represent.
Ian MalcolmBut there's also the ideals of beauty, the concept of intellect, What was curious is Tolkien was even asked specifically about that comparison.
Ian Malcolmto which he suggested that there is a, in fact, comparison that he's trying to make, although he curiously doesn't only talk about the idea that they have been sent off into the diaspora after the destruction of their land, which is referenced in the book, very curious, but also their desire for jewels, for mining, and a lot of the, what he called, it's very curious, because he called it highbrow culture, which...
Ian MalcolmIt's strange because the presentation that I see of the dwarves is actually quite the inverse, right? It's very guttural is perhaps the way I'd describe it. The men, for what it's worth, the idea of Gondor and Rohan, right? These are references supposedly, or some people would suggest, to the Byzantine Empire and the fading of that empire towards the end of its time.
@malleusigOh, that's interesting.
Ian MalcolmYeah, some would also say the Greeks or the Romans, but this idea of the era of man is coming to an end, obviously a very prominent theme throughout the story. There's obviously some others that are in there, but before we go kind of down those and pull that apart, really quickly, Rabbi, any thoughts there on that concept of the elves, their attachment to nature, to beauty,
Ian MalcolmWho might you suggest that is perhaps in tie to? Or like you said before, is that maybe a reference not to a race or a people, but rather a set of ideals? And then we'll go to Ann.
@malleusigThat's, yeah. I don't know. So remember, Tolkien is writing everything from the viewpoint, from the European standpoint, right? So it's like, these are not universals. They're basically all how Europeans see others. And so... I always kind of linked Asians with elves, right? That was always my explanation. I always, for some reason, connected the Japanese with elves.
@malleusigAnyone who's been to Japan and spent time with Japanese people can probably understand why I would say that. It's like they're very elvelike people. In the best way, in the most fantastic way possible. What's interesting is the Japanese were very, very good fighters in a surprising way. The thing about the Japanese was when they had their big coming out party after they had modernized and they came out against Russia, everyone expected them to fail.
@malleusigThey were like, yeah, well, the Japanese, like there's a little tiny country and there's like these short people because they were known for being short back then. And it's like, what are they going to do against Russia? It's like these big hulking giants. And then they basically wiped the floor with Russia. And everyone's like, what the fuck, right?
@malleusigSo it's like... and so like so for me the elves kind of mapped down to the japanese pretty well um but i could be i could be completely wrong in that i have no idea um but yeah for me they always they kind of about kind of in races no it was word exemplified this archetype of the extremely highly um civilized more civilized even than the europeans um
@malleusigvery mentally active very smart very uh very strong people in the mind um but also extremely not not vicious but like you know you don't want to with them basically like that's for me that's that's a really that's what what encapsulates them uh yeah and did you want to jump in and yeah
Speaker 2Sure, yeah, thanks for the mic. I was going to mention the Ents. Oh, yeah, the Ents. The hippies. If you want to provide your input on that.
@malleusigYeah, they're the hippies. Basically, the Ents are like the college kids that smoke pot and just want to hang out.
Ian MalcolmWell, and for what it's worth, Rabbi, as another little call-out, and Ann, curious if you remember, I can't recall the name of this group, but there's also this kind of, they look like a wandering tribe. It's almost perhaps maybe an Eastern group of people that come in with the Elephants, I think they call them, Rabbi, at the end of The Return of the King.
Ian MalcolmThat's what I was going to say, yeah, and it's a very, I mean, that one seems so... Overt almost, because every piece of the costumes, the language, the behavior, even the people themselves, it's one of those components where it's hard to suggest that there's not something, at least when Peter Jackson brought it to life, maybe it's less overt in the books.
Ian MalcolmBut yeah, there's so many of these different groups, and it's one of the things I find so remarkable about the story is they did such a wonderful job with the world building. We've got all these distinct individuals and like... Ann was just saying there with the Ents, and what are they supposed to represent? The tree beard, right?
Ian MalcolmI like your call there of the hippies. And actually, I mean, this is kind of jumping around a little bit, but I suppose why not? Because this entire concept in the two towers, I can't help but notice that the Ents, the hippies, as you called them, essentially want to stay out of everything. They sit around, and it's kind of funny that you call them the hippies because they speak...
Speaker 3Very slowly.
Ian MalcolmAnd they don't really do much. And I think one of my favorite is at the, I think it's the end of the first day of the trees deliberating what they're going to do. And it's all gone dark. The stars are above and Miriam and Pippin say, well, what have you decided? And the tree responds, he goes, we just finished saying good morning.
Ian MalcolmNot really accomplishing much here. and I bring it up because ironically though it's perhaps the hippies as you describe them that the only thing that motivates them to go to war is the destruction of mother nature and when they do the thing that they go directly at is not necessarily evil for the sake of evil but rather it's almost like they go to war against industrialism and I call that out because they end up even flooding Saruman's castle, his encampment, etc.
Ian MalcolmAnd in the process, they destroy all of the equipment, all of the machinery that they have been using to basically convert the trees and Mother Nature into this military complex, if you will. So it's a very interesting, kind of overt little visualization there, if you want to talk about it.
@malleusigYeah, I mean, basically what gets them really moving is them seeing trees getting cut down, right? They're like, everything is very... Everything is very abstract and cerebral until they're like, wait, hold on a second, you're killing trees? We need to fuck this guy up, right? And that really gets them going. They're also kind of, like in the Harry Potter books, for me, they're kind of a parallel to the centaurs in the Forbidden Forest, right?
@malleusigBecause they really don't care about anything else outside of themselves. They just don't, they don't care. Like, unless it affects them, and then they're like, hey, we're going to activate, right? And they're very, How can I put this? They're very... Shit, what's the word? Not abstruse. Passive? What's that?
Speaker 2Passive?
@malleusigNo, not passive. They're very inscrutable, I guess is the word. Because the centaurs and the ants, likewise, it's very difficult for people to figure out what's going on in their heads. They don't communicate... they don't communicate with others very well right and they're very kind of locked off for that reason um they're inaccessible uh to outside to non-ants for that reason because we don't really understand what they're doing it takes like you said like the whole thing about them getting together and it takes them three hours to say good morning to each other like they have they definitely have their own way of doing things and it's not really accessible to humans yeah
Ian MalcolmNo, very well stated. And so, Rabbi, to come back to the idea of the fellowship, right? So, and perhaps we can, I know we talked about this in the last space on Lucas and his work, but this idea of essentially the hero of a thousand faces in Joseph Campbell. I mean, obviously the overlap between the adventures of Luke Skywalker and that of Frodo, the parallels are striking, right?
Ian MalcolmYou've got this character who kind of is off on their own, You could say perhaps that they are somewhat insignificant, not in a way of mocking them, but their life is just pretty normal, right? There's little Frodo living in the Shire. There's this call to adventure, which is kind of thrust upon him because of the ring getting passed to him via Bilbo, and obviously Gandalf recognizing what it is.
Ian MalcolmAnd I mentioned Gandalf, of course, being the mage, right? He's the wise... Wizard, he's the teacher, just like Obi-Wan Kenobi to Luke, right? And so off they go on this adventure and we'll, you know, kind of venture and meander through that and we'll ultimately end up arriving right back at the beginning towards the end of this space, right?
Ian MalcolmAs we get towards the end and conclusion of the story. But it just, it's so on the nose with the ability here to have this story that it's, just like with Star Wars, it perfectly follows this progression that Campbell would have kind of described as the archetype of all these great adventure stories. I'm curious if you had any thoughts on that.
@malleusigYeah, I mean, it's the reason why, I mean, so there wasn't a Joseph Campbell around when Tolkien wrote it, but Tolkien basically, I think, he basically reconstructed, he constructed the same theory that Campbell did 40, 50 years later, right? So he, because he knew, he knew, It's obvious from the way they wrote it. He knew the importance of the hero's journey.
@malleusigHe knew the importance of the character arc. He knew what was psychologically gratifying to people to read. And that's all the same stuff that Campbell got into, basically. Because Campbell's whole thesis was that the hero's journey is essentially an immutable archetype that's probably hardwired inside the human brain.
@malleusigum and what it is essentially is that every other animal what he talked about was that every other animal has an instinct system which is the set of the set of behaviors that do not need to be taught they are simply hardwired into your dna and so you you literally come out of the womb knowing how to do this stuff like you know deer learn how to walk within the first couple hours of their life they can run around and follow the deer around
@malleusigBaby Chickens. Baby Chickens know to run back to their mother when they see the shape of a hawk flying overhead. And they don't need to be taught this. This works even if they've never seen a hawk in their entire life. It's so strong that even if you take a cardboard cutout in the shape of a hawk and you draw it over the chicken pen on a line,
@malleusigIt will have the same effect. The very shape of a hawk is enough, passing over them is enough to make them run back to their mother. And the kicker is, when they do the same experiment, but they pull the hawk shape in reverse, it does not work, right? So it's not just the shape, it's the movement of the shape. And all this is hardwired into baby chicks the minute they're born or most likely previous even to that, right?
@malleusigSo... every other animal has instincts we have instincts too but they're downplayed we don't really talk about them as much we don't really we don't like the idea that humans would be born with instincts because that would raise a whole set of uncomfortable questions about free will and about you know uh you know what are the differences again what are the differences
@malleusigbetween groups of humans and their different instinct systems right which could lead to a whole set of very very uncomfortable conversations um and then uh and then you know again between the sexes the sexes with different instinct systems as well obviously and so you um we tend to not to talk about that kind of thing we tend to veer away from that conversation whenever it comes up and but it's still a reality right it's still a real thing and
@malleusigWhat happens with stories is stories, they lock into that instinct system. The stories that really hit us, that really get us and stick around and have millions of fans around the world, the reason they do that, the reason they have that effect is because they link into this underlying psychological framework that is in all humans.
@malleusigto varying degrees, but it's in all of us and it's part of basically what's kept our species alive for millions of years. Going back even back to the pre-human era. When you don't have the ability to speak or formulate or invent complex tools, then this instinct system is basically what keeps you going. and it keeps you grounded in a world that is, was far more chaotic than the one we live in today in many respects.
@malleusigSo I guess that's my take on it.
Ian MalcolmNo, very well stated. And so to throw out one more question, then we'll go down to Soap who has his hand up.
@malleusigI think one of the ones- Shawntay Wise was before Soap actually.
Ian MalcolmOh, perfect. We'll go to Shawntay then. Thank you for calling that out. So, and trying to, Respect the order of man here in these spaces, right? So I love that. And so we'll go there in just a second. One last little question that I have for you, particular on the fellowship, is this idea of the ring that can rule them all, right?
Ian MalcolmThe whole point of this first piece of the saga is them discovering the ring. Okay, we've got this thing. It's really dangerous. We can think of it as the Death Star. It's the super weapon. It's the whatever. And the thing that's so curious about that weapon is it seems like it simultaneously gives you nothing but lust for the ring, while it also, if you put it on, gives you some kind of powers, which in the, let's say on the finger of Frodo, doesn't really result in him being able to do anything much but become invisible, which I suppose is a power, but it's not like he can use that and destroy things in doing so.
Ian MalcolmAnd simultaneously, that ring's calling out to everybody around him. And we've got one of the men, Played by Sean Bean, who in so many movies, why does he have to die? Such a great character. And yet, so it calls out to him along with so many others. And it is Frodo who is chosen to take the ring so that he can then be the one to try and figure out how to get it to Mordor, right?
Ian MalcolmAnd everybody else agrees that he's the right person to do it. And so I'm kind of curious how you read that critical decision. What you think Tolkien was trying to suggest when he put it on the hands of the Hobbit, the person who perhaps was, I don't want to say the bumpkin, but the innocent individual. Rather than giving it to the wizard and the mage, and we know that Gandalf specifically rejects it outright.
Ian MalcolmHe says, I cannot take that. So many of the other characters along the way, whether it is the primary of the heroes with Aragorn of the men, he turns it down, declines it. One of the women who is, I guess, of the trees. I can't remember if she was an elf, right? She passes the test but says, I can never put it on because if I did, it would do all kinds of things.
Ian MalcolmSo I'm curious how you read both of those things, both the idea that this ring gives you all of this incredible power and yet seemingly just exacerbates the worst traits and characteristics of everybody and why then it would be most appropriate for this... It's almost like Frodo is a rabbit, right? He's not peaceful because he's righteous.
Ian MalcolmHe's peaceful because he can't really hurt anything.
@malleusigYeah. He basically is innocent. And that's why he's the only one that gets to hold it. But again, it ages him. It basically takes away all of his innocence. He becomes so aged as a person by the end of the book. So first of all, with the ring, What's the first thing we notice? It's made out of gold. So there's an obvious analogy you can draw right there.
@malleusigSo the first thing that I think people would say is, well, it's money. So it represents money. Money basically can be used to corrupt even the rulers, even the strongest of men, even the most... People who consider themselves the most... InViolet or Incorruptible can eventually be corrupted by the right amount of money.
@malleusigAnd that's one thing. It symbolizes the modern banking system. Okay, so that's where I was going to take it. So that's a few steps out. So the first, I think, the naive analysis that it just represents money, but then you just... Who was that? What was it? Uncensored, right? Who said that?
@joann_marieIt was Unity. Unity, I think.
@malleusigUnity. So basically, the next step then is it's not just money. Now we're getting into the idea that it's this organized system of money that goes in and corrupts. And so what's the analogy to that? Well, who do we see going in and basically using money to corrupt rulers? It's this international banking system that you just called out, right?
@malleusigWhat it does is, and Trucella walked us through this in a space one time, basically the way it works is the bankers realized that the first thing they realized was that it made a lot more sense to lend to kings than to regular people because it was much larger sums, first of all. Second of all, the amounts were guaranteed because if there was ever any difficulty in paying it back,
@malleusigThey could simply tax their subjects to pay it back. So the payback was guaranteed and it gave you leverage over the kings because now they want something from you and you can give it to them. And so you end up with a system where the kings now have, they're getting something from the bankers. They're getting money. And the money can be used to fight wars against other kings
@malleusigand to get what the kings want, which is more land, more prestige, more notoriety, right? And they want to take over the world. Every king wants to take over the world, right? And they're like, well, I'll make this alliance with the bankers to do that. But what it does is it essentially makes you their slave because now you have to pay back the loan.
@malleusigAnd if you lose your war, then essentially they get their money anyway because they plunder you through the other king, right? and if they if you win your war then they get what they want anyway because now uh they get all their money back um and plus plus the interest and now they control an even more powerful king so it basically because the king will want to borrow money again in the future and if he doesn't if at any point the king ever decides to go against them what will they do they will simply stop lending money to that king
@malleusigand they will start lending money to the other kings who want to attack that one so it basically becomes a golden shackle where it's it's both something that you want and it also enslaves you at the same time so in that sense yeah i think it's a fantastic metaphor for that there's also um you know now we're getting into now we have that established now we're getting into the call it's in the book of revelation where you have the uh
@malleusigThe Whore of Babylon, essentially. No, I'm sorry. The beast who has the phrase Whore of Babylon, Mother of Harlots, Mother of Obscenities, whatever, on its forehead. And what does the beast have? The beast has seven heads with seven crowns. And the crowns represent the kings of the earth, right? The beast has basically enslaved.
@malleusigAnd that maps onto both what we see in Tolkien and in what we're seeing in real life today. So that, I think, would be my take on the ring.
@malleusigAnd that's before we get into it.
Ian MalcolmWhat's that? No, it's really well laid out. And so that concept of central banking, what a curious call out. And if you think about it, the ability for that to pervert, distort, or control just about any of these kingdoms, very, very appropriate. Thank you for that, taking us down that little toll. That was fantastic. And so really quickly, so this idea of the first book, again, it's kind of setting the stage.
Ian MalcolmWe've got lots of interesting things that do take place. I find the Mithril kind of coat of arms or let's say chain mail that he receives. He's got his sword that glows when the orcs are nearby. All of these things, very curious little adventure and kind of little nods. The one that we got to call out before we kind of move forward to the next little piece of the trilogy is this, I think it's the creature, what lies beneath, I think is the term, that they dug, the dwarves of all people.
Ian MalcolmIsn't it curious we come back to the dwarves and their mining, their inability to just know when to stop, to recognize when you've got a lot, right? And so instead they dug too deep. The Balrog?
Ian MalcolmBecause he knows that it might be down there, right?
@malleusigYeah. Yeah, if I had to put my finger on it, I guess if the dwarves... Okay, so the dwarves are the race of beings that essentially love jewels and love mining, right? And their women are... And this is going to sound kind of... Their women are indistinguishable from the men, right? And I would say that kind of like...
@malleusigIt kind of like leads you... to Ashkenazi Jews, basically, right? Because I've, and especially maybe Israelis, even though Israelis weren't a thing back then, but anyone who's met Israeli tourists can probably tell you that Israeli women are vicious, man. Like, they're absolutely fucking vicious. Like, they may not look like the men, but, like, they are just some of the most hostile, like, just inherently.
@malleusigEven when they're pretending to be friendly to you.
Ian MalcolmVery greedy.
@malleusigVery greedy. well i'm not getting into greedy because like greedy is not really like yeah they're kind of all greedy that's just kind of their culture but like the women in particular like they're just very um they're very man-like in the way they go about the world right um and so and if you make them angry or you make them angry or you like you know cross them it's like you'll learn very quickly like they they want your neck like they will come after you
@malleusigThey'll do it in a way that is not going to be able to trace back to them, but they're the real gangsters. They really are. And then the whole thing about being greedy for jewels and gold kind of thing obviously leads back to them. So if we're going on that analogy, then I would probably say that it sounds very much like what happened during the captivity in Babylon where they...
@malleusigThey took over, they did the same thing in Babylon that they did in every other empire they were in where they basically, they started by farming out their daughters to the rulers so that they would, you know, so Jews would be born into high positions and then took over the empire that way, right? They took over the city that way.
@malleusigBut then when they got into the secret societies and, you know, the secret societies are they're right in the old testament like in the the old testament literally has instructions on how to start a secret society so it's one of probably the earliest document we have on secret societies and when they got in and they got in infiltrated the babylonian secret societies uh that's when you know that's where they have the beginning of the talmud and all of this kind of dark magic that i think uh includes things like summoning demons right summoning the other gods
@malleusigand using them in addition to Yahweh for your purposes. And that's where my mind goes, is essentially where they may have bitten off more than they can chew and become enslaved to a higher evil than they were ready for, is definitely one possibility in my mind.
Ian MalcolmIt's a fascinating concept, and the reason that I wanted to bring that up, and I'm not sure if any of some of the other speakers that have come up here would maybe want to tap into this one, or Rabbi, if not, would love to throw it to you, because this is actually, it's essentially the conclusion to the first story, which is the Balrog dragging Gandalf down, and it's Gandalf the Grey, right?
Ian MalcolmAnd what's curious about it is, for those that walked out and hadn't read the books for the trilogy, were unfamiliar with where it was going to go, they probably thought that's the end of Gandalf. And then obviously the second film comes back as Gandalf the White and tells this story of how he was dragged down and ultimately vanquished the Balrog and that he has now returned.
Ian MalcolmAnd the thing that's so curious about the return, and this is why I bring this up because of this idea that Tolkien said that this is a Christian story at its core. When he does come back, the thing that's so fascinating is that He both refers to himself as That Was Me, so he makes reference that he was Gandalf, but by saying was, is essentially something anew, right?
Ian MalcolmIt's essentially like he's been reborn, perhaps he is risen, as they would say in the Christian faith. And I'm kind of curious on how you read that, right? What's the significance there? And is he dead, and this is a new version of him? Is it, right? How do you take that to be? Exactly. Right. And he also, don't forget, he has all these new powers and kind of a higher capability as Gandalf the White.
Ian MalcolmIt's not just a new robe, he's got a new set of tricks up his sleeve, right?
@malleusigYeah, I know. So that's the more interesting thing, it's because his whole take when they're asked about, you know, Gandalf the Grey, when they ask him, is like, he basically, from his point of view, he hasn't been Gandalf the Grey for a very long time, like maybe even thousands of years, right? so he was he almost forgot about it so that means that we're talking about this idea of basically you know when he went into something something out some other dimension some other state of being where time is either a non-issue or it's a non-concern or it it runs different than time here and so now we're getting into
@malleusigThings like what near-death experiences talk about the pre-incarnative or post-incarnative state. Or what other people call time-space versus space-time. Which, for me, is very much ahead of its time. It almost makes you wonder if... Tolkien didn't himself have some kind of mystical experience like if he at one point tried mushrooms or he had an out-of-body experience or a near-death experience or some kind of visionary experience where he was taken out of his own body and he was he experienced the post-incarnative state for himself and then wrote that into his book because that's not something you find anywhere
@malleusigyou can make you can make the analogy of if Gandalf is Christ if he is Jesus you can make the analogy of Jesus being you know being gone for thousands of years and then you know prophesize to come back and have a second coming Some time in the near future, everyone wants him to come back, everyone's rooting for Jesus to come back, I know, but, you know, we have no idea what's going to happen.
@malleusigBut then, you know, he would have had that same, in 1917 or 11 or whatever, whenever he wrote it, they would have had that same tradition. They would have had the same expectation of Jesus coming back sometime soon, and it still would have been a couple thousand years. So, he could symbolize the second coming of Christ, definitely.
@malleusigBut he could definitely also be something else. He could be a... He could be... He could be embodying a theology that transcends Christianity at that point.
Ian MalcolmNo, and that's why I wanted to ask that question because it is such an interesting dynamic the way that in particular Peter Jackson presents that on the big screen where you can see the, what's the, Ian McKellen who plays him. You can see that he's Let's go to Mr. Truthseeker.
Ian MalcolmAnd then we'll go back over to Ann, who just tossed her hand up. Feel free to throw up your hand if you do want to jump in. And if I'm not mistaken, actually, why don't we take a pause here? Because I think it was Shantae, and not sure if Shantae, if you do want to jump in, certainly feel free to. And any thoughts on anything discussed thus far, or that first kind of piece of the saga here?
Speaker 4Hi, but first, can you hear me? We sure can. Yeah, welcome. Okay. Hi, thanks. So I want to talk about how I've been really interested in this story ever since I was a kid. I'm 42 years old now and this story is the reason why I decided to become a reader myself because as a kid I had no interest of reading and this is the story that actually made me want to read.
Speaker 4So I want to talk about the elves a little bit because I got interested in the elvish language because I have noticed that in some of his books at the very back of the book He had like this thing going on so that you can actually learn the language. And I have noticed that the word Elohim was in there. And I've noticed that the word Elohim technically means God in Hebrew.
Speaker 4So I was thinking that the Elvish language, he was kind of turning it into some kind of like an angelic language. So I was really interested in that.
@malleusigThat's possible. There was because if you look at what happened with John Dee, for example, John Dee, was supposed to have deciphered the angel's language and that was the root of all his magic.
Speaker 4Yeah, that is correct. And you kind of got ahead of me on one part because I was going to go into the whole Gandalf the Great and Gandalf the White, but you guys kind of covered that up for me because I've been waiting for a while. But I also want to talk about the dragon.
Ian MalcolmNo, and feel free to add in your content, your thoughts on that idea of Gandalf the Gray and Gandalf the White. I mean, there's lots of interpretations and would welcome any of your thoughts on it.
Speaker 4Yeah, I also thought that was like Jesus Christ because of he re-risen, right? So you kind of covered everything in my thoughts about that already. I want to talk about the dragon because I have played many many video games and I've read many stories about dragons and I've noticed that uh every time there's a dragon involved they're always around gold and um and most recently as of last year I started to get into um free energy and ether and I've noticed they had used um gold and silver and as you know nowadays gold and silver is going up in price by a lot which is like wow but I have noticed that um gold and silver
Speaker 4Ashley has some kind of attachment to the ether and I noticed that there's dragons that does not have wings but they were flying in the sky because as you know they are called a mythic creature in our world but it's kind of funny that in the Chinese zodiac they're they have lists of all these real creatures but they have a dragon there so these dragons are were actually real at one point of our lives so I dove into volcanoes that we have in our world and I've noticed that
Speaker 4every volcano in our world actually if you have a bird's eye view of the volcano you would see a dragon and i've took notice that perhaps these volcanoes we have in our earth are all the grave sites of these dragons and i want to know what you think about that there's a i'm sorry can you say the last question again like every volcano we have on our earth
Speaker 4If you have a bird's eye view, if you take it like a camera or whatever, you will see a dragon. And I've noticed that perhaps these volcanoes are grave sites of dragons.
@malleusigWait, if you take a bird's eye view and you find a dragon? That's new information.
Speaker 2Like the typography? You're saying the typography?
@malleusigLike it's shaped like a dragon?
Speaker 4Yeah, you'll see a shape of a dragon in every volcano on Earth. You'll see like its head shape. You'll see its wings.
@malleusigI don't... You're going to have to... Give me something to search for because I've never heard of that and it does not sound true.
Speaker 4Yeah, you're going to have to look into that for yourself because I got interested in that and I noticed this and I was like, wow.
@malleusigBecause I'm looking at photos of volcanoes right now from above on Google Images and I basically just see big nipples with smoke coming out of them.
@malleusigHow do you see dragons?
Ian MalcolmWhy don't we do it this way? Is there a specific volcano that you would recommend Rabbi look up in real time that you think is the most demonstrative of what you're suggesting? They look like puckered assholes with smoke.
Speaker 4I'm going to have to get back to you on that. If I find a couple of images, I'll definitely send it over his way. You might find it very interesting.
@malleusigI might. I might. I just don't... I can't find any reason, I'm not attacking you, I just can't find any reason to believe what you're saying right now. It's not like I don't trust you, but it's like, you've just told me that, you know, all cats are round. And I'm like, no, no, my experience doesn't really back that statement up.
Speaker 4Okay, so, I'm gonna go ahead and move on, but I have noticed that in every video game and every story that these dragons, they're always around gold. And, um... And then, you know, it kind of attaches with the whole free energy theory with gold being able to kind of like suck up and use ether, right? And I've noticed that they always like to swim in gold.
Speaker 4So I was thinking maybe that's their power to fly or something like that.
@malleusigYou are connecting a lot of concepts together in ways that I would not. I'll just start by saying that.
Ian MalcolmWe're starting to veer into the, and I try to always be very respectful, but we're starting to go into what feels like troll territory, and I don't mean like the literary version of it. No, I know, yeah.
@malleusigSo my take on dragons is, the way that I think of dragons represented in literature is basically the same as Joseph Campbell's, where he talks about how whenever you see dragons ascribed, they basically are guarding one of two things, or both. Hordes of gold or beautiful virgins, beautiful women. And the kicker is that dragons really don't have a use for either of those things.
@malleusigSo they represent this kind of greed that goes beyond craving things that you even need. It's just having things for the sake of having them. That's always been kind of my understanding of what dragons represent is this It's kind of like the dog in the manger idea where the dog doesn't eat the hay. He doesn't do anything with it.
@malleusigBut he'll growl at you if you try and take it away from him kind of a thing.
@malleusigYeah. You know. So that's good. Good input anyway. Thanks.
Ian MalcolmYeah, no, thank you for that. And let's go to another hand as kind of part of the pause here. I think it was Soap, if you're not mistaken. And Soap, feel free to jump in with any of your thoughts on the first piece of the trilogy or anything else that's been discussed.
Speaker 5Yeah, can you hear me?
Ian MalcolmWe sure can.
Speaker 5All right, right on. So when Rabbi, I think you were talking about the hierarchy and you stopped at like Sauron, I believe.
@malleusigis that and you said is that did you were you relating that to the demiurge is that what you said or would it be more like satan hello rabbi can you hear us sorry yeah so dem so he does definitely seem to represent at the very least the demiurge like figure because he's trying to usurp you know the god's place as rule of the earth kind of a thing and he's trying to basically remake
@malleusigThe Earth Into His Image. So in that sense, yeah, he does seem very Demiurge-like to me.
Speaker 5So when you keep going above that to like, what was it, Eru, Iluvatar, and like the Einar, Valar, and Maiar or whatever, I mean, I know everybody knows that this was supposed to be from a Christian perspective, but would you just apply all those Christian concepts to those archetypes? or Beans in the Tolkien world, I guess.
Speaker 5You could. I mean, you can probably get into it.
@malleusigI'm not really up to date in terms of, you know, religious Christian discussions of the hierarchy of angels, right? Because I know that that does exist as a thing. But Sorin was, I think Sorin was a Maya, right?
Speaker 5I can't remember all of it. I learned most of this from my daughter. He was a Maya. Yeah, because she's been teaching me over the last eight years because she reads all Tolkien's stuff.
@malleusigSo Sorin, he was not only a Maia, but he was the mightiest of the Maia, right? So he was basically the strongest of the angels. And so what can we connect to? Who else was the strongest of the angels until he fell? So he's very much a Satan character, right? He's very much a Satan slash...
@malleusigDevil slash Iblis type slash whatever character. And he even has the same kind of origin story. When you look at... Can I put this? When you look at what he's doing, he has the same... Fuck. He's very Demiurge-like. You can almost say that he's Yahweh, right? Because a lot of the Christians... they got into the esoteric stuff they you know the Gnostics especially they their belief was that Yahweh was a usurper god he was basically the demiurge he was this god that came over and said i'm going to pretend to be the god and take over earth that way right and so he's very much that kind of figure and in a certain way you can almost look at him as maybe this is Tolkien
@malleusigencoding his own Gnosticism into a work that he knew he couldn't he couldn't just write a book about the Gnostics and say like I believe this too right because like no one read it but if you encode your beliefs into into what seems like a more harmless context then you're more likely to get them out there which is what we see with, you know, Jews in Hollywood, for example.
@malleusigThey do this in Hollywood all the time. We don't encode their agenda into our movies in a way that's so subtle. We don't pick up on it as such. And so I think that, in a way, you could look at this as Tolkien encoding Gnosticism into Lord of the Rings.
Speaker 5Yeah, that's crazy. I always thought of Yahweh as more like the... I just didn't know how much he was actually... I didn't know if I was reading too much into it, because he was supposed to be Christian.
Speaker 6Oh, I will say, Tolkien did say in letters that this is a holy Catholic work, right? I mean, he was a very devout... He's actually the reason that C.S. Lewis converted. He just couldn't get him all the way to Catholicism.
Speaker 5Yeah, yeah. But again... Is that a Catholic concept, that Yahweh is a Demiurge, though?
Speaker 6No, not Catholic, no. But it is very Gnostic, it is.
@malleusigYeah. But again, it's one of those things where you couldn't really say it either. At certain points in history, you would have been burned or killed for believing in it. So we have to wonder how much of what Tolkien said was real and how much of it was kind of blink twice if you're free to speak kind of stuff.
Speaker 5Right on. Yeah, it seems very Gnostic to me.
@malleusigSo that's it. That's all I have. Yeah, I mean, the whole idea of Yahweh, when you really look at it, if you look at the Bible without bias, you look at the Old Testament, the New Testament without bias, it's fairly obvious that Yahweh is not the same God that Jesus talks about. So this could definitely be a call to that.
@mighty5thorThat is a great, that's a heresy that has been refuted. It's called Marcionism, where you say that the Old Testament God is different from the New Testament God. That is such a fringe idea. Yeah, that is so fringe and that is not orthodox in the least.
@malleusigThere's always one in these rooms. Listen, they didn't refute anything. No heresies have been refuted. All they did was kill everyone that believed them. The reason why heresies may be fringe today is because they literally killed everyone else who believes in them and only a few survived.
@mighty5thorOkay, so your version of Christianity is the only true one, no matter how minuscule your followers are, if you have any.
@malleusigThat's the only one that I believe in, but I'm not going to force it on somebody else.
@joann_marieI also believe that, and I didn't even know Rabbi believed that.
@malleusigI mean, listen, Liam, I'm not going to try and take your God away from you. What I'm going to tell you is, look at how well the majority of people on this earth understand anything. All right. And then ask yourself if that means that if the majority agree on Catholicism, that makes it has to be true, right? Like most people have absolutely no idea what goes on in politics.
@malleusigThey're obsessed with entertainment and celebrities. And even then they don't understand what's going on with that. They don't understand evolution. They understand like the barest, like most people don't understand how like a computer works or electricity works. Like most people have no idea how anything in this world works.
@malleusigAnd yet you're going to tell me that the most important indicator of whether something is true or not is how many people believe it?
@mighty5thorThat is a great point. Yeah. Just because the majority of people believe that Jesus was a historical person doesn't make it true.
@malleusigWell, I believe he's a historical person, but also it doesn't make it true. Right. If just because people believe it doesn't make it true.
@mighty5thorThat's a good point. Yeah. I will have to marinate on that.
Speaker 7who was basically the Sauron of the first age. He was a fallen archangel. To me, that's really the Satan figure. That happens in ages before. And then Sauron is an apprentice to Melkor. So Melkor is, if I remember correctly from the Silmarillion or whatever, that his power gets lessened, right? It could be, I look at Sauron as kind of,
Speaker 7An up-and-comer. Like, I think there's a lot of beings as the ages go on that will rise up to be the Sauron. The legacy of Satan is really the fallen Morgoth, which becomes Melkor in a physical form, right? But he's defeated. But the corruption he brought to Arda or to Earth, Middle Earth, that stayed, right? And so really, Sauron is just kind of an angel.
Speaker 7So I look at him as two layers down. He's just like a really strong Maiar. So he's similar to Gandalf, right? And so like Gandalf the Grey, to go back to that then, Gandalf the Grey is more of an angel. Gandalf the White comes back. He's not a Valar, but he has extra powers. And what was interesting about the wizards, because they're Maiar too, just like the Balrog.
@mighty5thorSo what is Jesus? Is Jesus a wizard or a middle soldier?
Speaker 7I don't know who the Christ is.
@mighty5thorDo you see how this all sounds so crazy? That's what the person of Jesus is. It's like Dungeons and Dragons times two. It's a totally fictional story that people are taking as literal.
@malleusigIf we're going to ask you which character is closest to the Christ, it would probably have to be Gandalf because he's extremely good. He sacrifices himself to help his friends live. and then he comes back in a in a higher form after it right and so that's very similar to what we see happening i don't think we're getting the point the point is that this is fake well everything's jesus is like jesus is as real as gandalf well that could be true but like and we have religions based off of this
@malleusigAre we really doing this? Are you the person that runs onto the court during a tennis game, yelling at everyone in the audience, saying, it's just a game, the points aren't real?
@mighty5thorThat is a great point. That's a great comparison. That's totally relative. Yeah, that's totally relative.
Ian MalcolmLiam, can I ask you a question? Liam, can I ask you a question? Just out of curiosity. To Rabbi's point, if you were at a tennis match and you were watching the two people play for the championship game and you thought to yourself... You would have three Rabbi's opinions.
@joann_marieOkay, hold on, Liam. Hold on.
Ian MalcolmI'm going to mute you, and we'll try this one more time, and if you do something like that again, I'm just going to remove you from the panel. because we're going to have an adult conversation here. My question was going to be if you're at the tennis match and you're watching these two individuals play tennis hoping to win a million dollar prize and you're thinking I'm better than those people I could take the racket and I could win the tournament do you think the better thing to do would be to oh I don't know think through how you're going to
Ian MalcolmTry and get invited to the next tournament. Maybe go through the ranks. Work your way up to be at that stage with those professionals at that elite level so you can try to win the prize. Or do you think you would just run onto the court, as Rabbi said, and yell at the top of your lungs, I'm here! I'm the best! Let me play!
Ian MalcolmWhat do you think would be a better way to perhaps try to go about winning over the hearts and minds of the people that are in the crowd watching that match?
@mighty5thorWell, having a soft, subtle voice isn't getting through. So perhaps we go through another way.
Ian MalcolmSo the non-soft voice, so you're just suggesting that you would yell really loud after running onto the court, is that right?
@mighty5thorYeah, if courting you and stroking your hair... What do you think is going to happen as these two elite athletes play this tennis match?
Ian MalcolmWhat do you think is going to happen as you're flailing around on the court? They will have a realization that, oh, we are wasting our time watching sports ball.
@mighty5thorAnd here's somebody trying to break us through to something that actually matters.
Ian MalcolmOkay. And you think that that would work at all competitions, I'm sure, right?
@mighty5thorWe're just doing this exercise in creative thinking. Take me on that journey.
Ian MalcolmIt is creative thinking. It is a hallmark of high IQ individuals. And what's not is being obnoxious. If you want to try and... Rise to the ranks and play in perhaps the U.S. Open as a tennis champion. Work your way up. And my point in this little exercise that we attempted, and I don't want to say you failed or succeeded.
Ian MalcolmI'll leave that up to the audience. But my point was, if you want to win the hearts and minds of other people, don't just be brash and obnoxious. Don't present yourself as a fool. Very few individuals are going to believe you if you're sitting out under a tent or under a cardboard box shouting, I've got the brilliant idea to free energy.
Ian MalcolmAnd if you don't listen to me, It's because you're all a bunch of stupid people. And I'm not saying that to slur anybody that's in tough economic times, right? But we do need to be clever. We need to be smart. We need to present ourselves as intelligent and well thought out. That's how we win people to our ideas. It's not running into rooms and saying, Christ is a LARP.
Ian MalcolmHe's no more real. It's not going to land with people. If anything, you're probably going to have them saying in jest, Jesus Christ, frustrated.
Ian MalcolmIt might have just been merely a distraction, and you might just be doing this as a comedy bit, in which case, you had your fun. We're going to move on to the next person. Speaking of which, I know that we've got Mr. Truthseeker, and we've got MightyThor. I want to check in. Truthseeker, we'll go back to you, and then I want to get some thoughts from the MightyThor on the Mighty Lord of the Rings.
Ian MalcolmIn particular, Thor, we're on the first slash, the first half of the second story or book.
@mighty5thorCan I get four, five seconds on what Liam just... Interjected with. So, okay, Christianity.
Ian MalcolmEspecially because, Mighty, I know you're one who can punch his stove in ferocity, right? But it always comes with intellect first.
@mighty5thorMy fist is aching. Well, there's a time to be serious and there's a time to act the fool as my late... Sorry, I'm sick here. As my late mom, mummy, always said, stop making those faces. God will leave you that way. And... She was right. So here I am and that's why I have a voice for a face for radio and a voice for radio too.
@mighty5thorSo now I've heard Liam speak many, many times and I always hear this degree of anger as if he was hoodwinked into Christianity. But I would just ask rhetorically, I mean, if Christianity is a LARP, what is to replace it? 2.3 billion adherents on the planet, by the way. If Christianity and Jesus Christ are all A LARP, then what replaces them?
@mighty5thorWell, we see what replaces them. Atheism, maybe some agnosticism, but certainly hedonism and nihilism on the left today. It's not working. We'd all be, the vast majority of us, much better off in a 1950s America as opposed to this Bolshevik Revolution 3.0 we're in right now, where the Jews have subverted our demoralized us, stripped us of our morale and our morality.
@mighty5thorAnd anyway, I just wanted to make that remark in regards to Liam. I'd say a couple of other things. Gandalf's real name was Olorin, O-L-O-R-I-N. He was, I guess, the second ranked wizard of the Istari, the five wizards. And the five wizards were part of the 18 Maya, or Maya, as the rabbi, the good rabbi. You might compare the 14 Valar to, I don't know, demigods and the Maiar to angels and archangels with a higher echelon of them.
@mighty5thorBut anyway, I'll shut up. Continue. It's a great tale you guys are telling.
Speaker 7Anyway, so my point, yeah, I don't think what I was saying before is, yeah, I think the Valar, in my opinion, the archangels, the Maiar, the helpers, like a Gandalf. would be more of an angel. Gandalf the Grey kind of evolves, I would say, more to an archangel type status because the Maiar were there to be helpers, right?
Speaker 7They're not supposed to directly get involved, which I thought was really interesting. I mean, in certain key situations, they would show up as the helper, but they're really not trying to take charge of what's happening in Middle Earth, right? That's supposed to play out amongst the races, right? They're not supposed to take, because they have more power, they're not supposed to take
Speaker 7My understanding it was like Iluvatar or the Valar did not want that to happen. So they're like, that's why I look at angels as kind of guides, maybe archangels. So I think Gandalf the White has elevated power, but I don't know, like I don't look at him as a Christ figure because remember he faced off with the Witch King and the Witch King was just as powerful as him.
Speaker 7So are we going to say that, you know, when you talk about a Christ figure, then you're talking about Satan as the counterpart. and how many Satans do we have here? So I don't think it's really a perfect map of Christianity, although we all know that Tolkien and the Lewis connection and the Christianity in the background, I think some of that we can try to figure out that hierarchy.
Speaker 7In Western culture, those mostly Christian folks, there's other beliefs, but that's kind of the way that I see it. So Gandalf's like a really powerful helper. I would argue the Witch King is just as powerful as he is. Sauron's probably going to be more powerful. And my first point, and I'll end it with this, was that Morgoth, I think, is the original Satan.
Speaker 7And what's so devious about Sauron is I think a Sauron type of figure can keep rising up because of the fingerprints of a Morgoth. He brought evil into the world, and he has been diminished in power, but his legacy remains. The reason why Sauron can rise up is because there's still evil in the world. So I think a Sauron character is just a vacuum of power.
Speaker 7It's just a powerful being that will become the archenemy, and it can keep happening over and over and over again in future ages.
Ian MalcolmSo truth out of curiosity on that, it's a very interesting concept, this idea that basically, because Sauron at the end of the day... It's just the I, and there's lots of things that I suppose that I can do, and we can go into the idea of Palantir and surveillance states and all those kind of things. But rather, what I'd be curious about is it feels like the ring is designed to basically bring to fruition the evil of whoever it is that bears it, and through that to basically, I don't want to say represent, but to harness the idea of Sauron, right?
Ian MalcolmAnd so I'm curious if you think that that in a way is just the representation that there's evil out there in the world, perhaps that power corrupts, that absolute power absolutely corrupts, and that anybody that is wielding that power, no matter what their intentions, that they're ultimately going to be the embodiment of that which is evil.
Speaker 7I'm curious for your thoughts on that. I like the thought of the ring representing wealth or, you know, that element of power, because we all know that's... That's critical to the power scheme, right? The way things are now. And so Sauron, right, he was diminished before. He was defeated, I think, in the Second Age. And so he became the Necromancer, which is kind of this dark spirit.
Speaker 7And then he becomes the Eye, but he can't take physical form again until he gets the Ring. So the Ring was key for him to reestablish his power and to dominate. It's the one missing piece, right? He poured a lot of his power into that Ring. He can reestablish himself and reclaim his past glory if he has that one last thing.
Speaker 7And so that's interesting. I never thought of the ring representing the central bank of wealth or something like that. And evil in this world, if they get that one last thing, that one last element of power at the highest level, maybe they can pretty much dominate. So I don't know if that answered your question.
Ian MalcolmNo, and I mean, look, that's one of the interesting things about this story is that I don't think there's necessarily an answer. I mean, I suppose there's somebody that probably thinks they have it, but, you know, these are just ideas that we can interpret lots of different ways. And this is obviously one that there's probably a hundred different ways you could break down.
Ian MalcolmWhat does that eye represent? And how does the ring play into it? But that, to your point, that final piece, right? If you have the ultimate, let's say the money printer, that sure does buy a lot of power and it can turn just about anything Thank you so much for joining us.
@malleusigYou're talking about that organization that basically wants to take over everything, right? Which is, we're talking about the same thing.
@malleusigAnd the I itself, I mean, this is someone who, Tolkien was an aristocrat, I think, and he would have had access to this kind of secret society, especially from, like, he was in things like theosophy, that kind of thing, right? He would have been familiar with this, and this could have been his way of encoding it into his literature to wake up the rest of the world, too.
Speaker 7Thanks, yeah, good stuff.
Ian MalcolmYeah, no, absolutely. And Rabbi, so to come back to the story, so we're here on the second of the three books, right? And one of the central themes throughout this one is this idea of within the realm of man that you have these kind of dwindling power structures. You've got these kingdoms that are, and it's very curious because not only do you have the kingdoms that are kind of withering, but you also have some of their rulers who are under a spell.
Ian MalcolmAnd it's very curious for what you just discussed because one of the primary kings basically has a person sitting next to him who is whispering into his ear all of the commands, all the things that he wants. Some might say that's Howard Lutnick and Donald Trump, right? And that they are receiving their instructions from...
Ian MalcolmSoraman, who maybe we could make a connection to Netanyahu if we're going to think that the guy is Howard Lutnick, right? But that you've got this empire that's corroding, it's withering because its leader is under this spell of, ironically, the same power structure that has the ring behind it, right? Or at least it's trying to get that ring, I should say.
Ian MalcolmThey don't actually have it at the moment. But I find that curious in what you think, if anything, Tolkien might have been saying. Is this... This idea of the dawn of man or the end of the era of man, do you think he was writing anything of greater significance with the world that he was seeing around him, you know, maybe almost 100 years ago?
Ian MalcolmOr instead, is this just part of a literary work, it's part of the fiction, it's required for the progression of the story?
@malleusigI mean, I don't know how he would have seen it, you know, 100 years ago, but it definitely could refer to the fall of European men. Because the men in his book were very European-coded. Like, they were very European. They were essentially European men. So when he wrote the book, it was as if the entire world of Middle Earth was inhabited by non-humans plus European men, which again is also telling.
@malleusigSo it makes you kind of like start to wonder if maybe the other races are encoded non-European men, right? Because Tolkien knew about other races of men at the time, but also he lived in a time when essentially they were not a huge concern to anyone. They were not something people thought about. People didn't think about the Chinese on a daily basis in England in the 1910s.
@malleusigThey didn't think about, I mean, outside of the context of World War I, I can't remember if we were fighting with or against the Chinese in World War I, but outside of the context of who we were fighting at the time, no one really took other races into consideration. They had enough to worry about with other Englishmen.
@malleusigSo there's definitely a possibility that that was the way that he structured it. And if that's the case, and he's talking about the end of the time of man, then he could be talking about what we're living through now, which is essentially European man being corrupted from the inside and losing control even of their own domain, which is what we see happening.
@malleusigAll right. And then if it does happen, we're looking at, you know, what, a thousand years of darkness, you know, figuratively and literally. Right. Where it's like where Europeans become a stark minority and everything is run by Indians and Africans. Right. With a layer of Jews like being their managers, essentially. Right.
@malleusigAnd that's not. A happy picture. Even if you're not European, that's not a happy picture. Everything objectively ran better when Europeans were in charge. Look at South Africa in the 80s and South Africa today. Black people complained. They didn't complain because life was hard. Life was actually a lot easier back then than it is now.
@malleusigThey complained because they weren't in control. And now they're in control. Look what's happening in the place. It's going to be one of these things where it's like, yeah, the orcs are going to be like, yeah, we run the government. And then it's like the entire government is going to be covered with shit, right? And it's going to be just a horrible place to live in.
@malleusigAnd I don't know. I mean, did he see this? Could he foresee this coming? I have no idea. But that's where my mind goes when I read that, when I hear that concept.
@mighty5thorI'm reminded. Go for it, buddy. Okay. Oh, I'm reminded. Just the title of the great Pat Buchanan, The Decline of the West. And what did Gothmog, by the way, the name Gothmog in the books always referred to the name of the leader of the seven Balrogs, J.R.R. What was his name? Jonathan Ronald Rule, J.R.R. Tolkien. He said there were no less than three and as many as seven Balrogs.
@mighty5thorAnd the Balrogs, like that one omnipotent beast that was encountered in the deep recesses of Moria by Gandalf and the Fellowship. They are fallen angels, Maiar, fire spirits, right? And they were up to, I love to say there's seven because I love those creatures. The more, the better. And by the way, in the earlier ages, I'm sorry, in the later ages, there became...
@mighty5thorup to hundreds of these Balrogs, but they were much diminished in power relative to the, let's say, seven Balrogs, the seven Maiar of the First Age. And this one that was slain by Olorin or Gandalf or Mithrandir, according to the elves, was Durin's Bane, at least that's what they named him. I had a list of all of their names at one point, and back to that, the leader was Gothmog.
@mighty5thorNow, in the Return of the King, and I believe he appears before that. What does the character named Gothmog say right before he plunges his spear into the heart of the fallen first lieutenant of Faramir? He says, the age of man is over. The age of the orc is upon us, right? Okay, a little bit of faggotry there for the audience.
@mighty5thorThat's what he says.
Ian MalcolmFor what it's worth, Thor, I give it a 10. Okay. And any and all of that should, and I see a thumb up, other emojis, I think, yes, add any and all of the theatrics to this, especially given the type of space that it is.
@mighty5thorI will always remember my late mom's words, stop acting the fool, and so I'm going to continue acting the fool, mom. Okay, so, you know, he stabs him, and what's ridiculous, and this is what I wanted to say in chiming in here, You have the queer degenerate billionaire, Peter Thiel. My God, how did we get into this mess we're in, in reality?
@mighty5thorAlex Karp, the fucking nerd. I don't know what race he is. Not that I want to behead him if he's not white. No, no, no. But, I mean, these people are using their superpowers for evil. Palantir, by the way, for those listening, if you're not familiar with the lore... The Palantirs are basically the fancy crystal balls, the one that Saruman was staring into and kind of went mad, insane, because he was communicating with, directly, Sauron.
@mighty5thorI prefer to say Sauron and Saruman, okay? That's just me. You kids do what you want. And so that's why Saruman... SARUMAN OF MANY COLORS! If you guys ever saw the 1978... cartoon version of the Lord of the Rings. I was pretty gripped by that. And one of the ways in which Saruman of many colors intimidated Gandalf, did battle with him and imprisoned him, was by fully flashing him.
@mighty5thorI'm in San Francisco. Hey, cut me some slack. Opening his cloak, blinding him with a brilliant flash of light and colors. And that phrase was uttered in that cartoon. I am Saruman of many colors. And so with the corruption of Saruman, as American English speakers say, it made perfect sense for Eru Iluvatar, or God Almighty himself, to bring back Gandalf the Grey, who was number two in rank of the five Istari, the five wizards, elevated him to a position of higher authority.
@mighty5thorNotice, what did he do? Gandalf stopped smoking the halfling's leaf. The Halfling's Leaf is dulling your wits
@mighty5thorMy whole point is Peter Thiel and Alex Karp are using their technology and their superpowers. By the way, the Palantirs, again, those are the crystal balls used in the movie, and Anduril, A-N-D-U-R-I-L, was the name of the reforged Narsil. Narsil was the sword that, my God, my God, King, what was his name, Elessar, the King, the Numenorean King,
@mighty5thorThe father of Isildur, basically, you know, he and, my God, my God, what was his name? The Elven king, not Galahad, not Gwaihir, that was the eagle. Help me out, what's the name of the Elven prince that fought alongside King Elessar, who basically was killed, both of them were killed by Sauron, and it was... The son, Isildur, who picked up his father's sword, the shards of Narsil, and cut off the finger of Sauron, and that, you know, dismembered that, the ring fell, blah, blah, blah.
@mighty5thorAnd why did I- I just looked it up. Is it Thranduil? No, Thranduil is the father of Legolas, of Mirkwood, the Mirkwood elves.
Speaker 7Real quick, not to be an asshole, but Gothmog of the First Age is not the same as the elf lieutenant from the Third Age. Same name. Ann Daryl Palantir
@mighty5thorDriftoff into the West or now endangered status and eventual extinction. That's what these queer degenerates are doing. Alex Karp and Peter Thiel, among others. Go ahead. Sorry for the long diatribe there. I hope that made sense.
Ian MalcolmNo, I think it certainly did. Is it Gil Galad?
@mighty5thorThat's it. Gil Galad. Yep.
Ian MalcolmGil Galad. All right. I gotta say, that was a Grok special. I would not have been able to come up with that one on my own. But what I could have is, like you're saying there, Mighty, not only Palantir, you've also, of course, got Anduril, the defense company that is under Palmer Luckey. One of the very scary things about that company, if you look into it, yes, they make drones, they make all kinds of other things that are blowing things up all over the world.
Ian MalcolmOne of the weirdest parts is the way in which they've done that, and they've been as successful as they were, was because of the fact... That unlike other defense contractors who basically build to spec, they said, we're just going to make a candy store of things that blow up and sell them to the government whenever they want, which is a very different approach to doing business.
Ian MalcolmAnd you could suggest that it's also maybe a way to go back door in the sense that a lot of these contracts are kind of hard to understand where the money came from, who's buying, who's spending. And I just say it because that's yet another company that kind of came out of nowhere and all of a sudden is taking a large market share from some huge players.
Ian Malcolmwith very deep ties into, let's say, the world of the elites. But you've also got Dorin. You've got Mithril, which we talked about earlier. I think it's the chain mill that Frodo wears that protects him from swords and other injuries. And that's a venture capital company that obviously is tied to none other than Peter Thiel, as is, of course, Palantir.
Ian MalcolmYou've also got Erebor. which a little bit lesser known, tied to the same Silicon Valley folks, including Palmer Luckey. It's actually yet another one of his companies. And Erebor, here's a creepy one for you, is a, if I remember correctly, a crypto company. The thing that's the weirdest about it is basically a crypto bank of the future they're suggesting.
Ian MalcolmNow Erebor for those, and Mighty would I'm sure know this, cause he's very well versed with the stories. If I'm not mistaken is either the, it's either the, nah, I don't think it's the mountain. I think it's the town adjacent to the mountain where Smog the Dragon comes, kills all of the people, takes all of their money, all of their gold, and puts it inside the big, I don't know if it's a mountain again or a volcano, but either way, and then he lords over everybody's money after having stolen it from them.
Ian MalcolmDoesn't that sound like something the same group of people we often talk about would prospectively do? And so I figured I'd call that one out as well. It really is bizarre how many of these Peter Thiel, Palmer Luckey, Silicon Valley folks that are circling J.D. Vance Thanks, Ian.
Speaker 2Yeah, just a couple of things. Back to the ring itself and the tie to money. And I think it's interesting that the number is seven and the number of continents. I mean, there's so much symbolism with the number seven. But if you think of just back to Tolkien, right, just tying it to the real world and what he would have been experiencing.
Speaker 2Another thing that I wanted to comment on was the change of Gandalf's name from gray to white is in Catholicism, when you are confirmed, you have a new name, right? You have your name with your confirmation. And the other thing that I just wanted to throw out there, I think that would be interesting to have some theories would be, you know, in the story, there are
Speaker 2There's Frodo, there's Gandalf, there's Aragorn. There's three, to me, there's three heroes. And I think that's really an interesting take is the Trinity. And all three of them play into the ultimate victory. So I would just love to open that up and give that for everybody's consideration.
Ian MalcolmRabbi, not sure if you want to jump on that one, but that idea of the trilogy or the Trinity, very curious one. I had not thought about that, actually. And there are, you know, how do I want to ask? Because I think there's a question actually to be taken here. And what I mean by that, who was the most heroic person in the film, right, or the story?
Ian MalcolmIs it Frodo? Is it Aragorn? Is it Legolas? Is it Gandalf, perhaps? Is it none of them? Is it Sam?
Speaker 7There's so many options.
Speaker 2Sam, right?
Speaker 7Sam, yeah. He's the most selfless, right? He wasn't attracted to the power of the ring either. I think, yeah, I think it's really... Sam's really the hero because ultimately, I don't blame Frodo. He failed, right? He failed at the last second, right? So, but I think Sam was the most selfless maybe of all the characters.
Ian MalcolmAh, which actually kind of takes us in an interesting direction because look, there is a lot that happens in... The Second Film, The Third Film, or Book, however you want to kind of treat these. But in either, there are certainly lots of things that happen, but to that comment about the idea of heroism, it might be interesting to actually fast forward through because we got lots of battles, lots of fights, and I suppose we could pick those things apart because they're entertaining, but maybe there's not as much to unwind with them.
Ian MalcolmWhat is, is perhaps this idea of Sam, Frodo, and Gollum, which I think we need to certainly unpack. And I say that you guys are talking about Sam being the most heroic, and I think there's a very good argument to be made there. Perhaps the, not the most exciting, but the most selfless, the most noble, right? The one who's in it to the very end for the cause.
Ian MalcolmAnd there's actually one, there's one line that I found very interesting in the Sam Frodo story, their journey, which is the recognition towards the end that they're not gonna have enough munitions. They're not gonna have enough food, enough water, enough access to any resources to make it back home. It's a very curious piece because in that moment, these characters have basically decided, yes, we're doing this to the end and we're gonna give ourselves to the cause as part of the purpose.
Ian MalcolmSomething that we could ask the question whether or not Frodo would even be capable of doing that without Sam, because obviously we know how the story ends. And like was just mentioned, Frodo being incapable and so to kind of fast forward to that we've got those three characters at the very end climbing up Mount Doom together right and they are they're all at at one another's throats I suppose in different ways and maybe the first piece to unpack here before we get to the dropping of the ring and the idea of Sam and the hero is this idea of Gollum being the shadow and we were talking earlier
Ian Malcolmabout the hero of a thousand faces. This idea of the shadow that was built into Joseph Campbell's idea where the hero is best presented to the audience if you have something that embodies what that hero could become if they follow their worst intuitions. And what better way to do it than with Gollum who perfectly represents what Frodo will become if he takes the ring, if he proceeds down that path, if he locks himself in the cave.
Ian MalcolmFor 400 years and grows old and loses teeth and all those other things. Because obviously Gollum, once upon a time, just a normal person, right? Who became that thing because he could not give up the idea of the lust, the power, the whatever it was that the ring would represent. So kind of curious for anybody that wants to jump in on this one and the idea of Gollum as the yin, the yang, perhaps to Frodo, perhaps his representation of the ultimate...
Ian MalcolmSubmission to your lust, to your base desires, what he might represent. I'd be curious if anybody, either Truth or Mighty, or we just had Lou come up here. Maybe Lou, if you want to jump in on this one, I know you're kind of coming in blind, but this idea of Gollum to Frodo, any of your thoughts on the representation there or what Gollum might be designed to represent to the readers?
@joann_marieSorry, she's connecting again.
Ian MalcolmLou, do you want to jump on that?
Speaker 8Lou? Hey, sorry, I just got in, so I didn't quite get to hear what you guys were talking about in the previous, you know, five, ten minutes.
Ian MalcolmYeah, no rush. Let's go to Soap, who's got his hand up for that one. Soap, any thoughts on Gollum and the connection to Frodo, the ring, and what that might represent?
Speaker 5I actually had my hand up right before you asked that question. I'll just get this in here real quick. I was going to mention this earlier, but I didn't have the photo on hand. I dropped it in the comments. If you go to the United Nations, They have the one ring of power that they all sit around. And it made me think of Lord of the Rings.
Speaker 5A long, long time ago, I found this. And it is actually the power of control. Because if you look at the image, it's the exact symbol of the power button on your controller, any controller you pick up.
Speaker 5It's kind of like it has this golden look and they all sit around this ring and it's got like the one slice in the middle. So it's the power of control. It just made me think of Lord of the Rings a long time ago when I first saw that. That's it.
Ian MalcolmSo I'm going to check that out. Any thoughts that you might want to add on Gollum and Frodo? No, I don't have anything. Okay, let's go down to Adam and then we'll check in with Mighty.
Speaker 3Yeah, thanks mate. I think with Gollum we see apparently one of the river folk, he's a proto-hobbit of some degree I believe, presented as being more susceptible to the power of the ring, more easily enchanted by it. And I think Frodo's somewhat more resistant in his taking on of the family burden, as it were. and the decision I think by Sam when he and Frodo passed that point of no return as it were.
Speaker 3While Frodo bears the ring and perceives it as his dream, I believe by this stage, Sam is making a choice based on his values, if you like, of friendship and obligation, responsibility perhaps. but a promise that he made and therein I think the difference and often the ennoblement of the Sam character is the true hero of the books.
Speaker 3Thanks.
Ian MalcolmYeah, no, great commentary there, Adam. And Mr. Mighty, curious for your thoughts. This idea of Gollum, his representation perhaps as the shadow of Frodo and then The idea that perhaps Frodo is, while the hero, perhaps that Sam is even the more heroic.
@mighty5thorSo during the 80s, before any of you kids were alive, back in the first age, I'm kidding, you know, I played a lot of Merp, Middle Earth role-playing, great role-playing game, kind of like Dungeons and Dragons. I played a lot of that too, my God, from 1982. I was in sixth grade, 11 years old, and I balanced myself out.
@mighty5thorProto Baggins was primarily a Followhide of Followhide descent.
@mighty5thorknown for being fair-skinned, tall, and adventurous, mixed with Harfoot ancestry. Smeagol, or Gollum, was a Stoor Hobbit, S-T-O-O-R, a broader, heavier breed that loved rivers and fishing. Both were subtypes of the three Hobbit kinds, Harfoots, Fallow Hides, and Stoors. Though they originated from different distinct tribes, and it goes on here to describe their two families,
@mighty5thorAnd so, you know, Frodo obviously always had the example in front of him of his uncle Bilbo being corrupted by the ring. Remember that time Bilbo actually lashed out and became, when he saw the ring? I wish you could have seen me there for a moment, but Bilbo got a glimpse in Rivendell of the ring that Frodo was carrying after Frodo.
@mighty5thorwas saved by Arwen, the daughter of Elrond, right? That was such a great scene. She was on a white horse, and I don't know if you guys remember the cinematography, but basically, oh God, her name, fucking Eva, Elva, the actress, Arwen, Liv Tyler, Steven Tyler's of Aerosmith's lead singer, daughter. Okay, so Liv Tyler, Arwen is literally you know I'll carry him on the faster rider and all of a sudden out of the shadows right you you hear all these wisps of evil as she's uh you know striding away with with the dying Frodo because he was stabbed by a Morgul blade a Morgul blade they came from the barrows the tombs of these
@mighty5thorWhites, W-I-G-H-T-S, which were basically undead evil specters eternally at unrest. And these are the Morgul blades found by Gandalf in that cave troll in the Hobbit series of movies, that trilogy, the books, right? Okay. And so he was stabbed by the Witch King of Angmar, the leader of the nine corrupt souls of men, in the shoulder, and that never fully healed, blah, blah, blah.
@mighty5thorAnd that's why Arwen had to kind of save the day and rush him off to Rivendell for quote-unquote Elrond's magic to save him. But I just, the cinematography, please don't die on me yet, Alex, holy shit. The cinematography was awesome because at first she was being chased by four Nazgul, or Black Riders, and then all of a sudden coming in from both sides were the other five, so nine in total.
@mighty5thorThat was pretty epic. Why did I mention that? The original writer in the books was actually a high elf of the First Age, somebody else who was resurrected, yet another First Age elf who killed a Balrog by stabbing it in the stomach with a dagger, and both of them, this Balrog, my God, Glorfindel, G-L-O-R-F-I-N-D-E-L. That character should not have been Arwen.
@mighty5thorI guess they... Subplanted Glorfindel with Arwen because of...
@malleusigGirl power.
@mighty5thorWhat?
@malleusigIt was for girl power.
@mighty5thorYeah, liberalism, feminism. Come on, we gotta have girl power.
@malleusigIt was too early. It was too early to make Gandalf gay, so they had to do something. Yeah, yeah. Plus the love nature.
@mighty5thorPlus the love nature.
Ian MalcolmWhat are you singing?
@joann_marieSir, sir, beautiful, but please stop. Thank you.
Ian MalcolmI can appreciate the theatrics, but I'm not sure if it's a true or just trying to add to the concept. A lot of the rings was produced.
@mighty5thorSo I'll just, you know, he may have a few pints in him.
Ian MalcolmHe's probably... Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. So there's not going to be a fool me three times.
@mighty5thorI'll just end with this on this note. Back to your question at hand in 10,000 words or less, I think I'm gonna do it. So, Frodo had two examples in front of him. He had his uncle, Uncle Bilbo, who had longevity as the result of holding the One Ring, but he was corrupted by it. He saw that example and he saw the miserable figure
@mighty5thorEvil figure, at least half the time, that was Gollum. And so I think that kind of kept him, you know, reminded him of what he could become. And in the end, all Frodo was, was a pack mule with nearly no willpower. It was Sam, as the others of you suggested, who was urging him on. The guy literally picked him up and carrying him and then evil.
@mighty5thorSimea Gollum leapt upon them and they did battle. Anyway, it was all pretty epic. So that's, I think, what kept Frodo the strong will of his gardener, Samwise Gamgee, right? Okay, go ahead, thanks.
@malleusigAlso, I just wanted to point out something that I think often gets overlooked in these discussions. Gollum's name is literally Gollum.
@joann_marieReally?
@malleusigYou know what I mean? No.
@joann_marieIsn't his Smeagol and then the other one is Gollum?
Ian MalcolmWe should actually talk about that, Rabbi, this idea of the Gollum and its relevance. But yes, Smeagol, and I'm sure Thor could speak to this with greater detail. So Smeagol and Deagol. Out fishing, and that's how they ultimately stumble across the ring. And the curious piece about it is he was talking, Thor was talking about how he's a different breed of hobbit.
Ian MalcolmAnd sure enough, on this little fishing adventure where they discover the ring, it's within five minutes perhaps that Smeagol chokes out Deagol, who I think was his cousin or brother perhaps, and then proceeds to flee, but not immediately to the cave. They... They kind of elude to the fact that he had gone back, tried to be amongst his people, but they resented him.
Ian MalcolmThey noticed the difference. He got basically outcast and then becomes, I guess, known as Gollum because as he morphs into this cave-dwelling monster, stops consuming water, food, and kind of has this devolution to the point that he has this parasitic cough that just follows him everywhere. And in that cough, continues going, Gollum, Gollum, which is where the name originates from.
Ian MalcolmBut to your point, Rabbi, the whole idea of a Gollum and what it represents, maybe an interesting thing. Not sure, Rabbi, if you and or Thor would want to pull that one apart.
@malleusigI find it highly unlikely that someone as well-versed in religious literature as Tolkien would not have known what that word meant, even in the 1910s. And I think that this would have been... It's kind of his way to get the word, sneak the word in there by spelling it slightly differently, which sounds like something Tolkien would do, right?
@malleusigBut yeah, for anyone who doesn't know what the Gollum is, the Gollum is a legend. It's another one of the kind of like, you know, Jews are always like their best hype men, right? So it's like, it's another one of the same. It's a very, there's a recurring genre in Jewish literature of Jews getting one over the hateful, stupid Goyim.
@malleusigStop me if you've never heard of this. But essentially this is one story where there is a rabbi living in a town somewhere in Europe and he gets sick of the fact that his people are continually being oppressed by the evil goyim who are stronger than the Jews are. The Jews are just these weak pathetic little kind of like nerds that always get picked on and can't do anything about it.
@malleusigAnd so he decides that he is going to use his Jewish magic or a Babylonian magic and create an enforcer out of mud or clay. And he's going to bring him to life by writing. Is it the name of Yahweh on his forehead or is it just one letter? I always forget. Nobody knows. Okay. Well, you write something in Hebrew on his forehead.
Speaker 9I can't remember, but it was in Prague.
@malleusigZimperog, yep. So basically he brings the clay man to life and then the golem, it's called the golem, and then the golem goes around killing Christians for him essentially. And the only way you can shut it off is by erasing the word on his forehead.
@mighty5thorAnd what's interesting...
@malleusigjust to add to that what's interesting well uh he he wrote the the word emmet meaning truth in hebrew apparently oh my god oh my god blasphemy jewish me jewish magic requiring the word truth to work you have got to be kidding me Yeah, that's... God, it's...
Speaker 9I mean, that's what it says. I'm not sure.
@mighty5thorLike, I don't know this a lot, but that's what... Well, the IDF is the most moral army in the world. So this, you know, can really give us some context here, right? They're right. You speak truth. Speak truth and enter the eastern gate of Moria, right? Actually, it was Melon, which is Eldish for friend. Okay, as the good rabbi...
@mighty5thorwas saying here everybody should be familiar with well certainly Gollum G-O-L-L-U-M from the movies or maybe you were privileged and privileged white privilege you know with reading reading the books in the 80s the way i did in high school junior high um by the way i know some people who to this day read the trilogy every year every five years and they relive it it's kind of
@mighty5thorCool, I am not that way. I read the trilogy twice, once in junior high and once in high school. Okay, so the other kind of golem everyone should be familiar with is Frankenstein. Look at the name, Frankenstein's monster. That would be considered in Dungeons and Dragons or Middle Earth a flesh, ew, just a flesh wound, a flesh golem.
@mighty5thorAnd they really expounded, expanded and expounded upon I hated to admit that a golem was Jewish, but hey, at least it's evil and murderous. I can accept that. But in the game, both games, they have flesh golems, clay golems, stone golems, and there are a couple of others. Iron golems. It's kind of interesting. The all-powerful iron golems.
@mighty5thorAnd yeah, these are Jewish magic... They're called magic constructs in both of these games, just like... The social construct that is the white race. We don't exist, but somebody go ahead and pick it up, thanks.
@joann_marieThank you so much, Manny, and you're hilarious. Should we go to the next hand?
@joann_marieYes, okay, Balrog, go for it, welcome.
@cauldron53Hey, so I kind of always thought of the ring as sort of like a drug. It's so powerful and the pull is so strong. It overtakes your body, your brain, invades your thoughts. And in the first movie, Bilbo tried to trick Gandalf into thinking he had left the ring behind, but you don't trick Gandalf. He knew. So he eventually got the ring.
@cauldron53But yeah, like Thor said, when Bilbo had gotten to Rivendell and saw the ring again, That pull for that fix came back and he just like momentarily, you know, showed that evil side of himself that the ring had put there. So I've kind of always thought of it as almost like a drug in a way. I just wanted to say that, thanks.
@mighty5thorI think it represents temptation in general. And so with that said, Miss Balrog, what tempted you to side with Morgoth, formerly Melkor, my God, and you didn't, Evil, you are.
Ian MalcolmI'm so glad that we have Thor for what it's worth. Mr. Mighty, you are always a wonderful addition to the panel, but on this one where you know the backstory, it's phenomenal. And I'll actually... So, Mighty, I'm going to give you a question. This is going to be... This is one that I think the internet's tried to answer a couple times.
Ian MalcolmI'm going to be curious for your take. So, in the first film, as the Balrog has whipped Gandalf's ankles and is pulling him into the abyss... He looks up and I think the claim, I think the phrase, and if I'm not mistaken, I think at one point or another really looked into this, was the idea of fly you fools, suggesting perhaps that they should flee from the area as they're continuing to get attacked and the arrows are coming their way.
Ian MalcolmBut there's also the take that I suppose you could have about fly you fools because they should fly with the eagles. To get to Mordor, which obviously pick them up once they get there. And it's kind of like, you know, you guys could have gotten on the helicopter a long time ago and this thing would have been over in the first film.
Ian MalcolmSo, Mr. Thor, I'm curious for your thought on those two pieces. If that's what he was trying to signal when he said, fly you fools, or if he was just saying to get away. And either way, why didn't they use the eagles to begin with?
@mighty5thorYeah, I mean, people say, hey, Huckam Gway here. The Lord of the Eagles didn't just fly Gandalf in the One Ring to Mountain Doom and just drop it from 30,000 feet up. And the whole challenge was men, the will of men with the help of elves and these other creatures needed to defeat the evil that was contained in the One Ring.
@mighty5thorAt least that's how the story goes. Now, Ian, I would agree with you when Gandalf said, fly, you fools, meaning get the fuck out of here. What did he say prior to that? Your weapons... are of no more use here, right? Nobody can, you know, these are literally, you know, my God, my God, Maiar spirits, angels fighting each other for 11 days and Gandalf, well, it was mutual destruction.
@mighty5thorGandalf died and was brought back by God, Eru Iluvatar and remade, I come back to you at the turn of the tide as Gandalf the White, right? But look, if I were to smoke weed for the first time in 33 years, Ian, I would indeed agree with you that when Gandalf said, fly, you fools, he was saying, contact Gwaihir. He's right around the bend there, the Lord of the Eagles.
@mighty5thorAnd he has a half a dozen other eagles that can save, you know, all of this marching through treacherous lands. But that's my take. So, I mean, let me smoke some weed for the first time in 33 years and I'll get back to you, brother, and agree with you.
Ian MalcolmWell, there you have it. It would seem like a good suggestion to just get on the Concorde and all aboard, and we're going to take the ring and B-2 bomber it directly into the volcano. Curious suggestion. Instead, no, no, no. And perhaps one way to understand it is that the plight, the journey, the mission, the adventure...
Ian Malcolmis required in order for the dropping of the ring to have any significance. I don't know if there's anything to be said about that. But curious, Mr. Liu, Mr. Rabbi, either you guys want to jump in with some additional thoughts, if you have any, on some of the characters, some of the events, or perhaps the significance.
Ian MalcolmAnd then I think what we'll do is maybe pivot, and with maybe the last 20, 30 minutes here, we'll start to try to reverse engineer that idea of... Lord of the Rings in modernity, and where perhaps we see these ideas of the surveillance state, how they're represented within the books, and perhaps if Tolkien had any ideas that we would be living in the dystopia that we find ourselves in.
@malleusigI'm good. I want to hear a loose tape.
Speaker 8Hello?
@joann_marieI'm always like, I don't want to.
@malleusigMaybe he's quiet, yeah. I mean, everyone who has heard me talk about anything has probably gone. I've gone into the subject so many times. I am not for it. It's just fucked up, man, because it's like, one of the most demoralizing things I've realized, especially after, you know, Trump invaded Venezuela, is like... How little any of us really control what happens in this world.
@malleusigWe just control what happens in our own backyard, essentially, and sometimes it's hard to do that.
@malleusigIt's a thoroughly demoralizing topic. The idea that now they're going to have this huge surveillance apparatus that's run by Israel, right? Or it's run by rich Jewish billionaires. It's like... Like, come on. Like, for real. Come on, like, really? Like, we're gonna do this? Like, we could have flying cars right now, for fuck's sake, people.
@malleusigLike, if you assholes didn't keep fucking everything up for us, we could have had flying cars, enough food for everybody. We could have had a utopia that makes, you know, second-year college students' visions of what communism would do for us look like absolute, you know, hell on earth, right? It's just... We could have had something so much better.
@malleusigAnd why are we doing this? Like, really, why are we fucking doing this? Yeah, I do not, this is not a fun topic for me.
@mighty5thorI would, okay, if I can add to what you said, good rabbi. One thing that keeps me going, again, I'm probably the oldest guy in this space, I'm 55, I don't care. I discovered the sport, the art and the science of, Oh, God, weightlifting, Olympic weightlifting, bodybuilding, powerlifting, basically the stuff that True Teller gabs about all the time, the almighty trinity of attention to diet, exercise, i.e.
@mighty5thorusing your body in the way it was biomechanically designed with a degree of intensity, the applied control stress, that is exercise, and adequate rest, right? That is the best way to age gracefully. And I'm in... I mean, I act like I'm 13 years old most of the time, so that's to my benefit. If only I can get my body to be prepubescent again, too, that would be great.
@mighty5thorOkay, forget I said that. So what keeps me going, and I think this has a lot to do, I'm a fucking imbecile who self-deprecates half the time and the other half the time. I like to be serious, and I think a lot of you are that way, too. And so one thing that gives me hope, As long as I'm alive, is not my Catholic faith, but the Catholic morality that I was given, my brothers and I were given, exposed to, such that I just find it impossible that in the end, the good guys, the moral guys, the white hats, yeah, I'm a QTAR, there, the truth comes out, these white hats are in control, you know, everything's going according to plan, trust the plan, gang, so...
@mighty5thorLook, that's the truth. That's why Ian gave me a mic. I'm a fucking moronic baby boomer cue chart. I'm not actually in the middle of Gen X. But I digress because I was lying in the name of some idiocy there, a laugh. So, you know, back to being serious. I just find it impossible that these evil motherfuckers are actually going to enslave, say, us.
@mighty5thorThere's 345 million Americans. In the same way... The Communist USSR was created in 1922 by Vladimir Ilyich Lenin, and they had 69 years of the Soviet USSR. I just don't see that happening here. I kind of, and I'm going to sound like a total fucking pussy weird, I refuse in my own power, maybe I'll have to, you know, harness the power of FENOR within.
@mighty5thorDon't get me started on FENOR. and his half-brother, Fingolfin. I was always most impressed, you look at the title of the room, with the great elves of the first age. These motherfuckers. Feenor and his, I think, seven sons, who literally fought all seven Balrogs. And what was the name of that giant spider? Certainly not Sheila.
@mighty5thorSirith? What was the name of that giant spider? An all-powerful entity in its own right in Middle Earth and the First Age. We'll talk about that later. But yeah, call me naive, call me idealistic. This is what growing up Catholic will do for you. I just refuse to accept that we're going to be digitally enslaved by a bunch of fucking evil degenerate pussies like Peter Thiel.
@mighty5thorAnd I want to say something. It's Ian Space. I just have a hope. Can I say it? I have one hope and it's mine alone. None of you are allowed to agree with me. Okay, if it were up to me, I wanna see if we're actually heading in that direction, if these genuinely evil motherfuckers think they can enslave humanity digitally and otherwise, debank us, et cetera, and Trump is like a temporary detour, a ruse to lead us in that direction under J.D.
@mighty5thorVance's watch, I want to see more activities of Luigi Mangione. There, I said it. That's what I want. I'm not going to do it. Nobody I know is going to do it. Nobody in this space, certainly.
Ian MalcolmI just want to specifically just announce any kind of violence, any calls for violence, anything remotely along those lines. And look, I think I'll always call out that which I think is...
Ian MalcolmMaybe the wrong path to go down and also prospectively venturing down criminality. And that's just not one that I could ever support. So just wanted to call that out. But like I said, Thor, you're welcome to share your take.
@mighty5thorYeah, I know. And I totally appreciate you just letting me say that. Because lastly, guys, I've been following this for a while, like many of us have. And my God, I'm seeing violence and death threats with impunity from the left. at every level. It's like, my God, when will these conservative, family-oriented law-abiders actually stand up and defend themselves from this potential enslavement?
@mighty5thorI digress, guys. Thanks for letting me air out my opinions.
@malleusigMy take, MightyThor, listen, my take is that whenever you see something chaotic or horrible happening in the news, it's almost always, it's either a leftist or, unfortunately, someone Someone of the Darker Variety, right? Or it's a Jewish guy trying to stir up a fake hate crime, right? Or like, you know, how often do you see just a white Christian family doing something that's worthy of getting in the news?
@malleusigYou don't see it very often. So what I think we should do is just... We'll just give them like four or five states and let them all live together and then we'll just go off and be us. That's like... The worst punishment you can give them is making them live with each other. Right?
@mighty5thorWe're talking about the Zionists. The Zs, right?
@malleusigWe're talking about basically like... The dwarves. The dwarves from Miller. We're talking about the insane people, right? Because it doesn't map perfectly to Jews or blacks or women, right? But you definitely see over-representation. So, we need to figure out what the criteria is going to be. Like, leftists probably is a clean one.
@malleusigLike, if you really are a communist or a socialist and you think that we're going to create a communist utopia after it's been tried so many times and failed, then you're stupid enough that if we let you into polite society, you're probably going to destroy shit. So, we can put you into new, you know, I don't know what's going to be a good name for this place.
@malleusigNew Comunista, right? Whatever we name it, right? And then, you know, if you're a Black person and you think that, you know, you want reparations, you want the government to give you free stuff, but you don't want to take on any of the responsibilities of living in a first world society, you don't want to resolve your conflicts without violence, you want to have, you don't want to inseminate women, but you don't want to stick around and raise the kids,
@malleusigyou know you can go live there too right and if you are if you're like a Jewish guy and you're like one of these Jewish billionaires especially or media types and you see nothing wrong with getting into positions in our government or media and then using them to cynically sway things in your own interest or your ethnic group's interest against the interest of the rest of the country then you can go live there too
@malleusigand then if you guys are so smart you're so good at creating a great society go create a great society with each other show us how easy it is and then you know we'll follow your enlightened example but until then we can live peacefully and we'll have our rudimentary architecture or you know or whatever we'll have our ignorant ways and we'll live in peace by ourselves that seems like a great way to do it
Ian MalcolmNo, very well stated there. I know we've got some additional hands and some other newer speakers, if I'm not mistaken. We've got the Balrog and Unum, if either of you guys want to jump in with some thoughts on the story here, or Weird, who I also see down there, who I don't think has jumped in yet.
Speaker 10Hey Ian, yeah, thanks. Just, you know, I do want to hear people's take on the Owls, because I haven't really reconciled them. I have an idea, but it's too, it's not developed enough for me to share, but Lord of the Rings is so interesting on so many levels. Was it The Two Towers, the movie released in 2002, where the two forces of evil are merged together to bring about the rise of Sauron?
Speaker 10And so that's very symbolic with the Twin Towers going down, where I think you had the labor Zionists and you had the political Zionists that were the capitalists and communist forces kind of coming together for the final push to achieve Zion, where the eye of obedience rules over mankind. So very, a lot of symbology. Now, the thing with J.R.R.
Speaker 10Tolkien is that he was a Catholic, but he wasn't just any regular Catholic. He was a Jesuit. And he was, one of his closest confidants was a Jesuit priest. A lot of his stories were allegories. Well, allegedly, and I think that's true for some of the knowledge and the stories and the things that the Jesuits were into. and one of those that's very interesting to me is the story of Tom Bombadil.
Speaker 10Tom Bombadil was one of the first books that J.R.R. Tolkien wrote. And Tom Bombadil was this mage, you know, in the middle of nowhere where as depicted in the movie is in the show, I mean, Rings of Power is kind of little hut in the middle of a desert more or less, right? And that closely matches, very closely matches the story or the real life story
Speaker 10of a Jew that travels to Egypt in the 1300s or 1200s to see Abramelin the Mage. And Abramelin the Mage holds this knowledge of Kabbalah and witchcraft that has been passed down through generations since ancient Egypt. And to this day, there's the book of Abramelin. The cover of it has two pillars, just like Kabbalah. It closely resembles a Zohar that the Jews today follow.
Speaker 10and it has like mechanisms in there that we can see that are being used by corporations today, by governments today to manipulate us. And so, you know, why would the Jesuits have been so, you know, like interested or obsessed with the idea of Abramel and the Mage or ancient Egyptian Kabbalah? I think it holds premise that the IHS and their name doesn't mean the name of Jesus in Greek, but likely means the Egyptian Kabbalah, which is Isis Horus Set.
Speaker 10The three mechanisms that they seem to be using today to bring about Zion. So yeah, it's very interesting. Lord of the Rings, there's a lot of clues in there. I think Isis is open AI. She was the best of the gods in terms of witchcraft and sorcery and manipulation of people and minds. And then Horus, the eagle eye, seems to be the tech that they deployed in Venezuela, where an AI system was pretty much commanding
Speaker 10Military Actions Through Soldiers as a Hive Mind. And the last one, Set. Well, the Temple of Set with Michael Aquino is very interesting because that was fully integrated within the Pentagon. And there's a lot of parallels between Fifth Generation Warfare by Flynn and Michael Aquino, where it almost looks like all the political theater that's happening today is basically just the set mechanism of Egyptian Kabbalah.
Speaker 10All this kind of like embedded within the story of Lord of the Rings. If you guys don't know about the book of Abramelon, it's worth looking into.
Ian MalcolmWell, I can certainly appreciate some of that. And let's continue right along. I'm not sure if, Word, if you want to jump in. And if not, we can go over to Balrog.
Speaker 11Sure. Can you hear me? We sure can. Yeah, welcome.
@mighty5thorIs the word the bird?
Speaker 11It's weird. Well, I'm weird, but okay.
@mighty5thorNice to meet you, fellow weird.
Speaker 11I actually wanted to respond to what Mighty was saying in regards to a USSR-style enslavement and kind of Rabbi's take on balkanization. I'm just curious what either of them think. I appreciate the optimism, but like... When they've been outlining for like over a century that the goal is literally complete erasure of white people, what gives you that hope?
Speaker 11I guess I'm a little bit of a black pill doomer, so.
@malleusigYou want to go first, Rabbi, or should I? I'm sorry, I was typing. What was the question again?
Speaker 11The question was more like what gives you your optimism that we can be vulcanized or The only thing that really gives me optimism is the amount of effort, time and money that I see them putting into it.
@malleusigBecause if it was already a fait accompli, they wouldn't be trying this hard. The fact that they seem to have to try this hard means that they haven't completed it yet, and also it's a hard thing to do.
@malleusigAnd that, I think, alone gives me hope. If it's this hard to do, if they're putting this much time and effort into it and it's still not completed, they're still not kind of relaxed and just kind of chilling out, What that tells me is that it gets harder and harder the further along they get toward their goal. It's one of these things where it's like they keep approaching the goal asymptotically, but they never actually get there.
@malleusigIt's like an asymptotic curve where it always kind of approaches zero, but it never actually gets to zero. So if you look back at the 80s, the 70s, 80s, 90s, they were able to do whatever the fuck they wanted to.
@malleusigin secret because no one really looked at them. No one cared about them. The economy was great. And no one really wanted to talk about these subjects because, like, hey, why, you know, listen, we're having a great time. We're all making money. Like, why do you want to, like, why are you a crazy conspiracy theorist bringing up the Jews right now?
@malleusigIt's like, well, people that were talking about it back then, they were talking about it because they saw what was happening under the surface, right? Things were getting... A little bit worse over time. You know, like, listen, if it keeps going, this is where it's going to get to. And everyone looks at that and like, well, no, but it's fine, dude.
@malleusigIt's like, it's nowhere, we're nowhere near that bad. So like, what are you worried about? And so as things get worse, as their agenda approaches completion, more people catch on to it, right? Because the economy's tanking. We're being threatened with being pulled into a war in Iran that nobody wants. Nobody wants to go to war in fucking Iran, right?
@malleusigJust because Israel wants us to take them, to neuter them so they can have hegemony over the region, right? And people are waking up to their influence on the economy, the control they have over COVID thing with the vaccines and everything, like how many Jews there were in Pfizer, running the CDC, that kind of thing going on.
@malleusigEveryone is waking up to their influence over entertainment media and how the images are being used to control us because Things are not good anymore. It's not a good situation. It's like now, and their agenda has progressed to the point where it's like, you know what, maybe it is kind of a problem now. Maybe we do need to look at it.
@malleusigIt's like, you know, nobody really, you don't really notice a roach infestation as long as they stay inside the walls, right? It's only if you start finding them on the kitchen floor, you're like, oh shit, I gotta do something about it. And so now we're kind of in that stage, I guess. And so my hope is that You know, over time, the more activated people get about this, the more draconian measures they have to resort to.
@malleusigBut every every escalation in control reveals their hand a little bit more. You know what I'm saying? So it seems like a process which ends with some kind of conflagration. But I don't think it ends in our enslavement. I guess that's kind of my my version of the white pill.
Speaker 11Right. But to my point was. I didn't see it in Mighty's way either. It doesn't end in enslavement. I think it ends in extinction. I mean, when you see like accelerationist things like surveillance state, facial mapping, kill drones, things of that nature, it kind of just makes me more like that's what's coming rather than...
@malleusigI mean, that's what they want for us. I don't know if it's going to happen. I mean, you have... Look what's happening in China right now. That's what you had in China. You had that in China already. Like, we saw the drones going around and, like, you know, not killing people, thank God, but we saw the drones, like, flying up and checking to make sure everyone was in their fucking house, right?
@malleusigAnd, like, broadcasting, it's like, you know, try to fight the urge to live in freedom, right? It's like all this crazy shit went on in China. And they really maxed out... The government control of the people over there. China is really the R&D department of global control. But look what's happening to them now. Their economy is tanking.
@malleusigXi just had an attempt on his life. It was just a coup attempt that no one is talking about. Literally, Xi's body double was killed and a car explosion inside of one of the tunnels they use to go from place to place. And Xi was attacked by a group of his own generals in the hotel that he stays at, in one of these like special secure hotels that the Communist Party members have for the exclusive use, right?
@malleusigAnd so now we have this purge going on in the Chinese government to get rid of anyone that was even tangentially involved with this coup.
@malleusigand uh i mean who knows what's going to happen if america tries to do the same thing you know if american if america if if it gets to the point where the government is literally going to take away people's guns i suspect they're gonna give it they're gonna get about about three houses in before everyone else in the country calls each other like the nra just calls them and said listen it's go time get your guns get ready uh they're gonna try and take them from you right and then it's it's all gonna be over
@malleusigYou cannot have the United States military fighting the United States people. And they haven't been able to fill the military with Pakistanis and Somalis yet either. So that's not gonna work.
@mighty5thorI would add that 46% of the world's firearms are owned by American civilians. And to quote the late, great Ernst Zundel, The German-Canadian who devoted his life, like the still alive David Irving, the Englishman, devoted his life to, I guess, World War II history revisionism. What did he say? He said, America is not NSDAP Germany, where the military, police, and hunters had firearms.
@mighty5thorThe American people are armed to the teeth and, his words, not mine, filled with the spirit of rebellion. and he goes on and on to make us sound like we're the greatest fighting force planet Earth has ever seen. And I guess we are when you take into account the 23 million veterans who are highly trained and own all of the shit I own legally, HKMR556A1, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, level two and four body armor, stuff that's totally legal that everybody should own, thousands of rounds of ammo, right?
@mighty5thorIt's the American way, right? This country and the Constitution were designed knowing the history of others that governmental tyranny can happen. Yeah, you don't just, like so many of these leftists, they trust their government above all to create some kind of a eugenic utopia for us when in fact we're living in a global, thanks Jews, dysgenic dystopia where all of the retards and losers, I sound like a dick, that's what came out of my...
@mighty5thorare the ones having kids on the government dole. And so my optimism remains, like I said, I'm naive, I'm idealistic. I just don't see it happening when I see people in the streets of Osaka and Tokyo, Japan, and Seoul, South Korea, literally condemning Israel, Israelis, and Jews for their blatant genocide in Gaza, the West Bank, Southern Lebanon, Syria's destroyed overnight.
@mighty5thorNow we're ramping up, I guess, to destroy Iran, as I used to say. Sorry, Iran, Iran, Iran, Iraq. Okay, I mean, so that's where my optimism comes. And, you know, in war, war is a war of attrition. You lose two here and you lose 5,312 over here. Whoops! Totalitarian government didn't anticipate that, right? So look, I'm 55.
@mighty5thorI'm going to live till I'm 90. or maybe my inner high elf of the first age will allow me to live 9,235 years, but who knows? I mean, I'm certainly gonna live till I'm 90 then like my parents did. And I'm not, I'll just put it this way. I'm not going to die in my bed being fed liquid, more sublingual liquid morphine concentrate under the tongue for two days in the case of my dad and three days in the case of my mom.
@mighty5thoruntil their heart stopped. That's how most people die, by the way. You kind of lull them to sleep and turn off their heart so that they don't actually starve to death. My mom had 10 years of Alzheimer's dementia, died of end stage, and dad had a second stroke brought on by the Johnson & Johnson's COVID clot shot, which was actually pulled by the FDA.
@mighty5thorI don't know if you guys know this, pulled by our own Food and Drug Administration. Six weeks after, whatever, my dad's death. Anyway, that's all anecdotal shit. That's where my optimism comes from. Humanity is not going to allow these evil motherfuckers, you know, the rise of the age of the orcs and the Uruk-hai and the Olagai, the cave trolls, right?
@mighty5thorIt's just not going to happen. And, you know, we should have never allowed these misfit, miserable degenerates like Peter Thiel to amass such wealth. Maybe after we win this new war of the ring, we should never allow miserable misfits without children like Macron and Merkel and Theresa May and the vast majority of other leaders who are maybe married but childless.
@mighty5thorThey're not vested in the future. What's interesting about me and many of you who have a moral background Compass in you is I very much give a fuck. I spend 12 hours a day on spaces. I don't need to. I could just go out and be a hedonist and enjoy my life. I care, even without kids, I care very much about the future of my San Francisco, California, the USA, and Switzerland and Ireland, where my parents come from.
@mighty5thorI demand they be restored to their former glory, greatness. That's, you know, I'll sound like a fucking, you know, well, I was going to say a faggot of sorts, but that's one of my expectations in life, one of my demands. And I think that we're kind of spreading the word. We're trying to awaken people as to this tyranny we're on the precipice of.
@mighty5thorSo that's my prediction. That's what I think is going to happen. We just need to keep waking people up. And even people in Timbuktu and Bangladesh will realize, oh my God, it's time for this time, a global expulsion. That's all an expulsion. It involves no death. Go over here, live in the fucking corner. You're treacherous.
@mighty5thorI digress.
@mighty5thorBy the way, if you don't own firearms... One more thing. If you don't own firearms as an American, you're either... A coward and or just an ignorant pussy. Embrace the American way, the ability to fight governmental tyranny. They're quite fun. I used to be very much because of this medieval fantasy growing up, you know, just loving the Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit and Dungeons and Dragons.
@mighty5thorI was quite good in archery with the Boy Scouts from 11 and a half until they kick you out at 18 years old. I was one merit badge away. from being an Eagle Scout. And just to prove I'm not a cosmopolitan Jew, the one merit badge I never attained was citizenship in the world. So, even though I have triple citizenship. I digress once again.
@mighty5thorGo ahead. Thanks again.
Ian MalcolmThank you for listening.
@smallhatwatchYou know what? I really wish I could add to any insight on the franchise, but I've only ever watched it once. I watched each movie in theaters when I was very young. I was in elementary school, so I don't remember it that much, which is unfortunate. I feel like I should re-watch them. But the last speaker was saying, you know, get firearms to fight against the state.
@smallhatwatchFirearms are not going to be very beneficial against fighting against the state. Let's be real here. If things go kinetic, our AR-15s are going to be nothing against a 2000 bomb going through our house. No, that's actually not true.
@malleusigThat's actually not true. You look at what a fight like that would look like... You're talking about the American military is not going to use 2,000-ton bombs on its own soil, on its own architecture, its own infrastructure. You'd be surprised how useful small arms are going to be in that kind of fight.
@smallhatwatchIt was certainly an exaggeration. Obviously, they're not going to drop a 2,000-pound bomb on your house. But, I mean...
@smallhatwatchLook at the populace of the United States. So many people have firearms. And so many of those people who have firearms, they have more than one. They have more than 10. They have more than 20. People can out-frit their neighborhood and create a small militia. And I think that certainly serves its use. There's certainly use case scenarios where that's going to be beneficial.
@smallhatwatchI also feel like, I'm not trying to black pill anyone, but I feel like the pen is mightier than the sword. So yeah. Well, the pen is mightier than the sword.
@malleusigBut just look at how well Iraq went, right? In Iraq, the regular people didn't have any guns. It was all the insurgent militias, right? The regular village people, they didn't have any guns. They weren't allowed to have guns, right? Just imagine how much more difficult it would be trying to subjugate the entire continent of America with everyone, like you said, tooling up their neighbors, right, and having their own, every town having its own private militia.
@malleusigNot going to be easy, man.
@smallhatwatchNo, certainly not easy, and I don't think it's even feasible. I don't think it's possible, but also at the same time, we have to look at the last 30, 40, 50 years of the United States of America, especially since 9-11. We've seen infringements to the Constitution left and right, whether you're talking about the Patriot Act or things like the ATF does
@smallhatwatchum the constitution is uh pretty clear you know you have the right to bear arms and uh something about a regulated militia or whatever it is right so you would think that would be enshrined but uh americans are leaving losing their rights left and right um and i see very few people standing up for those rights uh you know you see it here and there you see people doing
@smallhatwatchOpen Carry, or doing marches and whatnot. But when it's such a small amount of the population that's actually engaging in that not only dialogue, but physical discourse in public, I'm not sure how beneficial it's going to be in the long run. Maybe in the long run, if shit really hits the fan, then yes. Maybe the Iraq model comes into play where you say, okay, well, we have a very well-armed population.
@smallhatwatchBut also at the same time, you just have to look at history and see how much rights have been taken away while the population has been incredibly heavily armed.
@mighty5thorHave you noticed no violence have come? has come from the right wing. And by the way, open carry is a moronic idea. If I were to rob a bank and I saw five customers in front of me with an AR-15 slung over the shoulders, I'd pull out my pea shooter. Not that I own a pea shooter, but I'd pull out, I'd say, it's turkey time.
@mighty5thorAnd I'd pull out my pea shooter and I'd just go pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, another motherfucking drop. And those idiots with their open carry would be gone. And then I could focus on everybody else who were unarmed. And that's why everybody should also get their CCW like I did in October of 2023, their concealed carry weapon.
@mighty5thorThen you have the element of surprise at all times.
@malleusigCan we reduce the Fed posting by about 30%?
@mighty5thorYeah, that was just a dumb reference to the movie Heat or other such movies, bank robbery example. Open carry is idiotic. And everybody on the right wing is still a law-abiding, for the most part, working citizen, and all of the chaos is coming the anarchy from the left. That's my observation over a couple of decades, but just to thwart what Turkey Time is saying.
@malleusigSure, sure. Let's see, I think that we have Anne, who wants to go next?
Speaker 2Thanks, Rabbi. Yeah, I... I guess I will be a little bit contrary here because we've seen that just what's occurred in the last six years with the COVID, we'll call it virus, the mRNA bioweapons, the continuous poisoning of our food, our water, our skies. I mean, honestly, what could we really put past these?
Speaker 2And again, to the point of what we've seen them do in mass is I wouldn't put it past them having strategic targets that, you know, you see this, do this, you know, the destruction in certain areas and do it or else, you know, submit or else. And again, I know I'm kind of black pilling, but I think we just, we do have to be realistic.
Speaker 2I don't know what a solution is at that grand of a scale. I will say this.
@smallhatwatchOne thing that I feel is going to be or could be very helpful is just getting to know your neighbors. I'm not saying exchange firearms with them. Those are probably legal implications when it comes to that. But, you know, they say... You've got some really bad turkey.
Speaker 2I don't know if you're out and about, but... Nope.
@smallhatwatchNo, it's my dogs are making noise right now. I apologize. Gotcha.
Speaker 2No worries.
@smallhatwatchBut, you know, make friends with your neighbors. They talk about well-armed and well-regulated militia. Well, you know, that's something that you can do on the grassroots level, you know, within your neighborhood. That's why I say get to know your neighbors. Go to the gun range with your neighbors. Have them, if you trust them, have them know where your firearms are located at.
@smallhatwatchKnow where their firearms are located at.
@smallhatwatchYou know, do training scenarios.
@mighty5thorIt's funny that we got onto this subject from Lord of the Rings, but we were talking about Palantir and tyrannical government in the Second Amendment. But I do want to point out an important consideration here someone sent to me earlier today. This is a pretty, look in the nest above or the pill below. This is, I guess, a pretty prolific TikToker, Chinese guy in China, kind of concerning.
@mighty5thorCheck out what he wrote. Listen to the video when you get a chance. Here's this Chinese guy telling American leftists, because let's face it, we are in the midst of a Bolshevik revolution that is getting more and more hot, kinetic as the days go by. Chinese guy telling American leftists to start documenting everyone with an American flag outside their home so that we can be robbed.
@mighty5thorI don't have a flag in front of my house. I never have, but so that we can be robbed of supplies for the revolution. and BeEaten. He goes on to say you'll be able to eat the rich if you steal their supplies. He's got over 30,000 likes on TikTok. They are the enemy. Eat them. Eat them with no regret. He also thinks doxing conservatives with a website is a good idea because conservatives will pay handsomely to have their info removed.
@mighty5thorHe must work for the Chinese government. So, I mean, that's something to consider, too. These Chinese, I guess, want to see I guess because of his actions as of late, Trump to fail and us to devolve into 69 years of Soviet-esque communism, but I don't see it happening. Mark Carney is pretty hostile too, right? And kind of forming a new pact with the CCP of sorts.
@mighty5thorSo there's all kinds of shit happening simultaneously that's to be of concern. I'm optimistic, goddammit.
Speaker 2I'm not too concerned about the Chinese podcaster or whatever he is. I mean, let's be honest. We've got bigger things.
@smallhatwatchWell, the concerns that he might bring up could be very well based in reality. For instance, last speaker just mentioned Mark Carney closing up to the CCP. That's a huge problem. I'm a Canadian. I live in Canada. I certainly don't want my country cozying up to the Chinese Communist Party.
@mighty5thorNo wonder why you're so black-filled, spreading your morose miserable into Ian's face.
@smallhatwatchWell, I apologize for that, but... We shall liberate you, kid. Have no fear. The way I feel, and don't call me kid, the way I feel is we're kind of 10 years ahead of what's going to be happening in the United States if you guys aren't careful and vigilant. Because we had our AR-15s 10 years ago. We were all good and dandy.
@mighty5thorYou just need our constitution, and I think the vast majority of Europe does too.
@smallhatwatchYeah, that'd be fantastic. I would totally agree with that. I mean, I am a Canadian patriot. I love America. I love Canada. But especially after these last two weeks, seeing the direction that our nation seems to be going towards, it's very worrying. I certainly don't want my government cozying up to the Chinese Communist Party.
@mighty5thorOh, one other thing that gives me immense hope, perhaps the greatest of hopes, is... You know, the legislative branch of the epitome of corrupt, all bought and paid for by AIPAC, right? Trump betrayed us. We voted for him three times. He is MIGA, Israel first, not America first. But the judicial branch, and you've got all kind of activists, you know, left-hard, retard judges and stuff.
@mighty5thorBut if you look at SCOTUS, not that Sonia Sotomayor, the type one fatty diabetic counts for anything, but she's Catholic too. You've got six originalist interpreters of the Constitution in these Catholics. Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, Amy Coney Barrett, good old Samuel Alito, Clarence Thomas, and Jonathan Roberts, the chief. And I don't see them ever writing off our Second Amendment or First Amendment.
@mighty5thorIn fact, in 2017, when SCOTUS was less conservative, and my God, if... Sonia Sotomayor, I believe she's already 68. If she dies of type 1 diabetes, you're going to have yet another. They'll put another Catholic on SCOTUS, not some moronic evangelical, praise the Lord, for he is good, Zionist, Protestant Christian. And so they ruled in 2017 that there is no special cutout in the First Amendment right of freedom of speech, assembly, or religion for hate speech.
@mighty5thorOkay, so there's no such thing as hate speech they ruled in 2017. And I bet a new ruling would be even more fervent than that. But forget I said all of that. We're doomed. I'm going to take myself out also, Turkey Tam. I'm talking shit, obviously.
@smallhatwatchNo, no, it's all good.
@joann_marieTurkey, but who would you rather cozy up with, Israel or China?
@smallhatwatchIsrael or China? Is that a serious question?
Speaker 12I mean, you're very worried about China, so why are you not worried about Israel?
@smallhatwatchI'm worried about both, but you know what, that's a good question. I'd have to think about it before I gave you a proper answer, to be completely honest, because I am more... Okay, maybe saying more isn't the right answer, but I am certainly very much focused on what's going on in the United States, because it kind of molds what's happening in the entire world, and especially Canada, because we share the longest border in the world.
@smallhatwatchSo if you were to ask me, Israel or China, who's the biggest threat to Canada? I would probably say, when it comes to Canada, probably China. Actually. I agree.
Ian MalcolmJust out of curiosity, Turkey, out of curiosity, do you think that it's China who has subverted the Canadian government and is mass importing individuals from the third world, or do you think it's Israel?
@smallhatwatchI think it's both, but Israel does not have the kind of foothold in Canada that it does in the United States. It certainly does, but it's nowhere near the extent that it is in the United States.
Ian MalcolmWell, we'll leave the audience to their thoughts on that. We'll go to Ann, and then we'll wrap everything up.
Speaker 2So, yeah, thanks so much for this space, Ian. It's been fantastic hearing from you and Rabbi, everybody. I just wanted to kind of pivot a little bit for the literary analysis. I was wondering if you have read, I think, Mighty, I was kind of quoting there a little bit, the Les Miserables.
Ian MalcolmI'm not sure if that's for the audience or for me, but I'm certainly familiar with it. I'm not sure about Rabbi.
@malleusigOh, sorry, what? I'm good, guys.
Speaker 2The question was if you had read Les Miserables.
@malleusigNo, I've seen the movie. I haven't read it.
Speaker 2You've seen the movie. I have no idea what that is.
@malleusigI know the backstory. The backstory of how the book got read is interesting.
Speaker 2Yeah, I just kind of wanted to throw the idea out there of... But I'll just table that for now. Just curious because I've just seen very many... There are similarities for the Tenardiers, and I think they definitely represent a certain tribe of people.
Speaker 2Even if you've seen the movie, I think you'll know what I mean.
@mighty5thorBy the way, Ann, if I could quickly, in 2000, I bought a replica of the one ring for a couple of hundred bucks, and I still wear it. on my left pinky. I was on a coffee date 10, 11 years ago wearing this one-ring replica on my left pinky, and this chick actually asked me...
@joann_marieMighty, did you get it in SkyMall?
@mighty5thorWhat's that?
@joann_marieNo, they sold one in SkyMall. I remember that. Oh, no.
Ian MalcolmI can't believe... JoAnn, that's a very curious reference. I'll give you two thumbs up for that one.
@mighty5thorJoAnn got hers from the sharper image for what it's worth. So it's worth, what, $60,000? Mine was like $500, and I still wear it on my left pinky. And this chick, I just want you guys to get a laugh out of this. She said, is that your wedding ring that you moved from your left ring finger to your pinky finger? Oh, this?
@mighty5thorAnd I went on and on about the Lord of the Rings and the one ring. You should have just said yes. Well, yeah, I guess I did in the end, but I mention that because Ann here, Ann-On, your catchy little name here, Ann, she put up a great photo. When you take the One Ring and you throw it in fire, supposedly, it lights up.
@mighty5thorThe inscription of One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness, bind them. That's the inscription that should be on the One Ring. You throw it in fire. and Ann-On's photo shows It's the Jews. I wish I had such a replica to wear. Okay, I thought that was hilarious, thanks.
Speaker 2I can't take credit for anything but just posting it, saving it from someone and then sharing it with all you fine folks.
@malleusigJust before we move on, I wanted to comment very quickly on Les Miserables, Kazan, you brought up. One of the main themes of Les Miserables is the letter versus the spirit of the law. I think it's probably the main theme. And that is a very pertinent theme when you get into discussions, cultural differences between the Jewish side and the Christian side of either the Bible or of humanity, because that is probably one of the key, if not one of the keys, if not the key issue between Jewish and Christian morality.
@mighty5thorAre we calling it Jewish Morality? Did I not get the memo?
Ian MalcolmIt's Great Britain and Jumbo Shrimp and Jewish Morality. All three wrapped in there. And speaking of rap, with that, I think it's a wrap on the conversation. I want to thank everybody for participating in this. I find the JQ to be a subject that obviously I enjoy dabbling in, understanding, and when we look at the world around us, I just saw LouRage put up into the nest a post that apparently there are Russian fighter jets being scrambled over to Iran, and you can make of that what you will.
Ian MalcolmI think there's a very reasonable argument that could be made that the powers that be are trying to send us into World War III, and to be honest with you, If I was a group of psychopathic parasites that basically controlled everything because I had manipulated and lied to everybody and people were starting to notice, I would probably throw the world into chaos as well.
Ian MalcolmAnd I feel like we are living through Lord of the Rings-type timelines right now, that the, let's say, the dawn or the dusk of man, depending on what side you view of the white pill, black pill, seems to be upon us. And we are facing kind of existential threats that primarily are not just foreign, but also domestic, depending on where you live.
Ian MalcolmAnd we need to keep talking about those issues. But from time to time, we also need to take a deep exhale. We need to think about things outside of the scope so that we can let our minds maybe have a little bit more entertainment, a little bit of infotainment, and perhaps not always just be hyperfixated on the things that are the most contentious and friction-filled.
Ian MalcolmAnd so, Mr. Rabbi, I want to thank you, as always, my favorite rabbi on this application, the only Rabbi on this application that I enjoy speaking with.
Ian Malcolmand so I just want to thank everybody for being part of this we've now got kind of act two in our let's say exploration of some of this great literature and so if you did not hear the prior feel free to go back it was on Lucas and the works of Star Wars and so now we've got that plus Lord of the Rings we will do Harry Potter and then perhaps we will continue going through various pieces of either cinema or literature again just to try and
Ian MalcolmFrom time to time, take a break from some of the most contentious and challenging of topics. But I do like that we were able to slip and slide some of the truths into the space for those that might have come in for the Lord of the Rings, not for the JQ. But some of that talk around Palantir, Andoril, and so many of those others, Erebor, all these companies, it does feel like Silicon Valley, largely led by, I guess, homosexuals like Peter Thiel and a whole bunch of Jews, like the people that sit atop, well,
Ian MalcolmJust about every other tech company, including, of course, Palantir, run by Alex Karp. There is a really scary power structure that's developing. They are trying to build their one ring. I believe that they perhaps believe that AI is going to be that ring, that they're going to surveil everybody, like the all-seeing eye, and in doing so, be able to send out their ring race, which I suppose might be ICE or maybe another rendition of some kind of federalized law enforcement apparatus, depending on where you are in the world.
Ian MalcolmWe need to talk about these things and we should talk about them honestly. We should talk about them nobly. Like was suggested before, we should try to find a compass that allows us to have the proper morality to reject them in a peaceful, righteous way. I'm always going to advocate for that and I say it because at the end of the day, look, I do think that to maybe go at Rabbi's comment earlier, yes, small arms and all of those things could certainly...
Ian MalcolmLet's say carry some weight. And this is a hypothetical that I'm throwing out. I want to be very clear about that. But while they are, so too is Frodo with his little sword. And if it wasn't for, let's say, the nobility, the honor, and the often, let's say, the pen being used rather than the sword, I don't think Frodo would have made it much further than the perimeters of the Shire.
Ian MalcolmWe need to band together, just like Sam, just like Frodo. We need to avoid the golems of the world, whether it's the literal rendition or the figurative ones. We need to find those individuals that we can learn from, that can be our Gandalf. I would suggest that in some ways, Mr. Truthteller certainly provides immense amount of education and enablement on this subject, as do so many others, Rabbi and JoAnn included.
Ian MalcolmAnd so for this space, though, I want to call out the big MVP of this one. Mr. MightyThor coming in with absolutely phenomenal information. I feel like in many ways, Thor, you were the army of the hills, if you will. You were the king who brought down his troops and saved the day. You saved the battlefield. by bringing such wisdom and interesting points.
Ian MalcolmI will again push back on the comment there around Mangione. Everybody's very crystal clear on that one. And I just as always wanna suggest that the views of speakers on these panels, I try to honor free speech and I will push back on them where I can, but the views are always of those individuals. But with that, I just, again, I wanna give a big thank you to everybody that listened, everybody that participated on this journey, whether you were in the pill or up on the panel.
Ian MalcolmIt's my absolute pleasure to host these conversations. We will continue doing them. And Mr. Rabbi, as a real quick little set of parting words, any comments, any thoughts that you would like to share?
@malleusigAny thoughts I'd like to share? I would like to share that I'm really happy that we seem to be healing as a nation, as a people. I think that Honestly, I think that things are going to get better in terms of what we see and understand about the world around us. And to a great extent, the dark times that we're in only appear dark because we've become so much more able to perceive what's really going on instead of having the wool pulled over our eyes so consistently.
@malleusigSo take solace in that. Take solace in that. It may not be that things are as bad as they look. It may simply be your ability to perceive has widened.
Ian MalcolmWhat a wonderful comment. It's almost as if, in a weird way, we are the hobbits in the Shire. At least once upon a time, we probably were. And I say that because for many in this room, you might feel like me. And not too long ago, whether it was a year, a decade, You probably, too, thought that the world was in a pretty good place.
Ian MalcolmYou looked around and you thought that your leaders were out for your interests, that they were trying to make your world and your nation a better place. And what do you know? We've explored, we've unfortunately come across that ring of power that perhaps, as was alluded to earlier, maybe it's Israel, maybe it's a group of nefarious people, maybe it's central banking.
Ian MalcolmRegardless of which it is, it unfortunately ties back to a set of usual suspects. But either way, We are now exploring that world and it is on us to try and build that coalition, to bring everybody together just like that fellowship so that we have a larger group of people that are aware of these realities, that can present a righteous indignation to them and a rejection of them in a legal and a peaceful and a moral fashion.
Ian MalcolmAnd so with that, it's actually kind of fitting. I made a post about this the other day for anybody that did not see it. I want to kind of part our ways here with some rather wise words from an individual that earlier in this space was suggested to be the true ultimate hero of this franchise. And so with that, I'll leave you with a little bit of his words as we close out the space.
Speaker 13So wrong. By rights, we shouldn't even be here.
Speaker 13The great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were. And sometimes you didn't want to know the end. Because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was with so much more?
Speaker 13The sun shines, it'll shine out the clearer. Those were the stories that stayed with you. That meant something. Even if you were too small to understand why. But I think, Mr. Fuller, I do understand. I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back, only they didn't. They kept going. Because they were holding on to something.
Ian MalcolmWe're going to continue fighting. We're going to continue speaking the truth. We're going to continue trying to make the world a better place. And as daunting a task as that may be, because there's a lot of villains that are out there, a lot of people who seem to just be hell bent on bringing Mordor to all of our doorsteps.
Ian MalcolmBut we're going to do what we can to try and wake up those that are willing to. We're going to try and advocate for them to just peacefully speak those truths. And in doing so, we will ultimately see That day, that dawn, and that new sky, that new sun, shine all the clearer. And so lots of love to everybody out there. Keep speaking the truth.
Ian MalcolmKeep doing what you can. Make a difference in your community. So much love to all of you. And as always, good morning, good evening, good afternoon, wherever you are in the world. God bless for everything that you are. God speed on our adventure to ultimately bring down this one ring. that is out to try and rule us all.
Ian MalcolmSo lots of love to all of you. If you're still interested in speaking or listening to some of these conversations, I know Truth Teller's probably gonna be opening a space not too long from now. So feel free to stop on by. He always puts on wonderful conversations that are super educational. And with that, lots of love to everybody.
Ian MalcolmAnd again, a big, big, big thank you to Mr. Rabbi and Mrs. JoAnn, the co-hostess with the mostest. So lots of love to all of you. Have a lovely, lovely, lovely day and keep up the good fight.